Amy Zalneraitis: Dogs are Carnivores, Turning Tragedy into Triumph, & Entrepreneurial Grit | MMP #230
Amy, welcome to Austin.
Speaker 2:Thanks, guys. I'm so happy to be here. It's nice to finally meet you in person.
Speaker 1:I know. We've done a few Zoom calls and it's not the same.
Speaker 2:It's just not the same.
Speaker 3:You might know Sunny better than you know Harry,
Speaker 2:honestly. I feel like I was hoping Sunny was gonna be here.
Speaker 1:We we drip out a little bit of Sunny content every now and then. She's the best. She might have we might need to get a bigger role for Sunny
Speaker 3:on the Meat Mafia. We people love her, honestly. She's so cute.
Speaker 2:She needs her own little microphone.
Speaker 1:We're working on getting potentially a new studio where Sunny would be allowed in, so that could be big.
Speaker 3:We're gonna have lots of We Feed Raw in the fridge if that's if that's if that comes to fruition.
Speaker 2:We're actually doing treats soon, which single ingredient amazing treats. Wow. We'll have those for you guys and for well, for Sunny. You guys can give We can try.
Speaker 1:We're adventurous.
Speaker 3:Do you remember how you two got connected? Because it was I think it was Harry. You had connected with Amy or someone on her team or something like that.
Speaker 1:Rob. Rob Ryan.
Speaker 3:Rob. Yeah.
Speaker 1:From Rosie's Guest. Yes.
Speaker 2:Yes. Rob, shout out to Rob. He's the best. He's the best, and they have such a good product. That fermented superfood powder is amazing.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. A lot of our customers add it to our food, and it's great. It's great. People love it. And even, like, all of our employees use it with our food for their dogs, and they're like, it just smells so good.
Speaker 2:Have you guys tried it?
Speaker 1:It's like a topper. Right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's like a mix in. So it's like a gut boosting, like, it's fermented, so it has all these fermented superfoods. And it also has cheese in it, so it smells really delicious. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's a really, really good product. Yeah. He And
Speaker 3:they oh, sorry. Go ahead.
Speaker 2:I was gonna say he formulated it with doctor Billinghurst, is the father of raw.
Speaker 3:He's the legend. He had
Speaker 1:him on the show.
Speaker 2:Yes. You guys did. Isn't he so amazing?
Speaker 1:Doctor. He's a legend. He's incredible. Yeah. His like, the historical perspective that he could, like, draw into the whole conversation around just species appropriate diets was so cool.
Speaker 2:I know. He's so, like and he was doing this at a time when, like, nobody was doing
Speaker 1:it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know? Like, was really such like a, I don't know, a pioneer really because no one was thinking this way. Vets, the vet community still isn't thinking this way.
Speaker 1:But
Speaker 2:as a vet to be really pushing this way of feeding, I mean, I think he he got a lot of criticism and, you know, he ended up being right.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. So he was the first episode where we ever really dug deep on just like proper canine nutrition. So this will be the second episode.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay.
Speaker 3:Big footsteps, but you can do it. And we were saying for the just for the listener to give them some context, so you're the chief branding officer of WeFeed Raw and a co founder as Yes. Yes. So you've graciously flown in here from Hilton Head Oh, Charleston. From Charleston.
Speaker 3:Charleston. Yep. But Austin is a very special city for you because this is really the founding city of your company. Right?
Speaker 2:So I know. It's so cool. It gives me goosebumps kind of. So We Feed Raw was originally founded by my sister, Alyssa, when she was living in Austin, Texas. My sister was a huge animal lover.
Speaker 2:We grew up with parents that were big pet lovers and rescuers, so we always had some stray animal that my mom had picked up off the street or my dad had found the cat. So we were just always around that. We were just taught from a very young age that if you're a good person, you're kind to animals. Mhmm. I think it's also just part of our DNA.
Speaker 2:You know, we come from a long line. Like, my parents both have you know, their families are are animal lovers, so it's sort of just like in our blood. But my sister really was I mean, even more than all of us, she just loved animals.
Speaker 1:Remember Was it dogs or everything?
Speaker 2:Everything. Like, I remember being a kid and just like we had like a mouse in our house. I think we caught it with, like, a humane trap. And I just have this memory of my sister, like, picking it up by the tail and gently carrying it outside while my mom's, like, screaming off the head. And she just loved all animals.
Speaker 2:It was just always a part of her. So she grew up to be a big rescuer of dogs, and she had, like, 10 rescues at one time. She was rescuing them from what's the Austin?
Speaker 1:Austin Pets Alive?
Speaker 2:Yes. Austin Oh, that's what you got, Sunny. See? So many connections. She's with us right now.
Speaker 3:I know
Speaker 2:my sister's, like, watching. So she had all of these rescues. And this was around, like, 2,007, 02/2008. And I don't know if you guys remember this. You might be too young, but there there was a big there was a spate of big pet food recalls in 2007 Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Which are all connected to contaminated wheat gluten in kibble. So what had happened was I think there was, a Chinese manufacturer that used melamine, which is like an industrial chemical instead of the wheat gluten. And this ended up sold it to American pet food manufacturers, ended up in the pet food, and killed and made sick thousands and thousands of dogs Wow. With kidney failure. So at this point, it was really the first time that, you know, people started thinking more critically about like, the what heck am I feeding my dog?
Speaker 2:Like, this bag of dried pellets, maybe this isn't the best thing. There was really just the beginning of a mind shift, I think. And so my sister was part of that mind shift. So she discovered raw feeding. She started feeding her own dogs raw meals, immediately saw the benefits as most people do, you know, when you switch something from a dry processed diet to a biologically appropriate one.
Speaker 2:And so she became an expert at doing this. Right? She just learned everything she could, read all the books. And so she started making meals for her friends' dogs and then friends of friends' dogs and the business grew from there organically. Her fiance Rich was a sushi chef.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. So he was really good at, like, helping to make the meals. He just, like, was a natural at it. So especially on a, like, a larger scale. So she sort of stepped back into the business side.
Speaker 2:He, you know, made all of the food and they delivered it door to door in their little Honda Element and, like, scorching hot Austin summer heat
Speaker 3:Oh, gosh.
Speaker 2:Door to door. And it was this really great business and one one of the first really to be doing it. And so it just kinda grew and they had a nice growing business. It was profitable. You know, they were growing steadily.
Speaker 2:It wasn't like explosive growth or anything, but they didn't really want that. And that went on for like four years. And around 02/2013, tragically and shockingly, my sister in her early thirties was diagnosed with late stage terminal cancer. So this was obviously just so gutting for all of us, my whole family. We kind of like rallied together to figure out what to do next.
Speaker 2:And we were all on the East Coast. Was in New York City. My dad was in Maine. And my mom was in Massachusetts. So we helped to move them and all the dogs and the business to Maine.
Speaker 2:But at that point, she moved the business from an Austin only business to an online business. So even though it was for like a really sad reason, moving the business online and shipping nationally obviously helped to grow the business exponentially. So it kind of like really grew at that point. And she you know, we went through all of the different things that, you know I I think when someone is young and gets diagnosed with cancer, you kind of look for all I mean, she did conventional treatments too. She tried chemotherapy.
Speaker 2:That wasn't working. So we also tried different things. Like, she was juicing cannabis, you know, seeing healers, you know, all all kind of, like, out there solutions to. And we were grasping at everything. We were you know, there wasn't really a lot of expectation that, not expectation.
Speaker 2:I don't think that it was like, I'm going to die. There was none of that really. It was like, I'm going to beat this really up until the end. Wow. And that was the way that she needed to die, if that makes sense, you know.
Speaker 2:So when she did finally die on February, we were all completely, you know, just grief stricken and in a lot of pain. But we didn't really have a lot of time to think about next steps. Like, oh, should we continue this business? Like, it wasn't it that type of business. It wasn't like, oh, we can take a step back for a month.
Speaker 2:Like, would have died tomorrow. Like, people were waiting for their food. Like, we had a factory with a crew showing up, you know, meat was getting delivered. It wasn't it was still a very small hands on business. So I don't know if it was part of our grieving process that we just jumped into it, but we all kinda came together.
Speaker 2:Rich I mean, this was Rich's job too, my sister's fiance. Like, he didn't have another job, you know. Wow. My dad came out of retirement to kinda take over my sister's role and do the business side. I went back to New York City where I had a full time job that made this my second job, which was, you know, I worked in marketing.
Speaker 2:So my background was really like, how can I make this with my background, I thought, how can I make this a real brand and grow the customer base and secure outside funding? We really needed that. So I did all of those things and we actually hired an agency in Austin, Texas called Preacher who helped us do a rebrand. So up until that point, the company was always just like a supplier of raw. Like, it wasn't really like a brand.
Speaker 2:I mean, had a different name. And and so I thought we needed something, sorry, that would really convey the philosophy and the values of what we were doing and also showcase how amazing the product was. And so that's what we did with Preacher. And to this day, I'd say it's like our after the product, our best asset. It's really kind of like, it's modern, it's clever, it's fresh, it's cool.
Speaker 2:There's so much shitty pet food branding out there that it really helped us stand out. And I think it is very attractive and resonates with the millennial demographic and also the Gen Z demographic who happened to be the largest pet owning demographic. Interesting. So it worked out well for us. But yeah, you know, I think like I always say like we, as a family, we were trying so hard to save my sister for that time from like diagnosis to her dying that we then had this other chance to like save her company.
Speaker 2:And I was like, we were already in this mode kind of and we didn't save my sister, but we did save her company. And there's a lot of beauty in that, you know. It's an extension of her. It's like, it's still her living on.
Speaker 1:That's a beautiful story and just yeah. It's moving. Like, I feel like a lot of people get when they are interacting with brands, they don't get to hear that authenticity and your guys' brand is totally that. I'm curious if your sister had like that moment with raw food when she was like testing out the idea. Was there a moment where it was just like, this is the thing?
Speaker 2:I just I mean, yes. There there was. Obviously, when you see how quickly a dog can improve like from their coat and their fur to like even the size of their stools. Mhmm. You know, everyone sort of has that moment.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I think that she just always what was so interesting about my sister is that she never questioned it. Even at a time, like, back then in 02/2008, 02/2009, like, this was like people on the margins of society were You being know? Like Totally. You had to be like and she never she wasn't like, well, I don't know. Is this right?
Speaker 2:Like, just knew. I mean, she had such conviction about it. And it's that's really I mean, she was the visionary. She was the one that why this came into existence is is because of her. I've just sort of developed it into a, you know, a thriving brand.
Speaker 2:But she's I feel like, you know, we sort of still are working together in a lot of ways because I hear her, you know, just the way that she would talk and and and the conviction that she had about this really helps to carry me through.
Speaker 3:It's pretty beautiful how like in the wake of this indescribable tragedy, in some way she left you your family like this ultimate gift where she gave you like her her like prized possession and like your dad's working on the business and now your husband and Rich and everything. Like, can't even imagine how special that is for you. You probably can't even describe how amazing that is or the feeling.
Speaker 2:It is. And and those guys have like gotten out of it more and they they wanted to, but they're still like, it's still a very amicable, you know, like, I think I do see it as a a gift to me. Think it's not a gift like, here you go. Here's like a $100,000,000 business. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's fine. Right? It was like, here's gonna be a shit ton of work and you're gonna learn a lot. And it's gonna be really rewarding because of that. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:That's the type of gift it is. Yeah. And it's every day and it has been. It's really it's taken me out of my comfort zone. I've been able to do things I never thought that I could do.
Speaker 2:I've learned so much. You know, the raw feeding world is pretty crazy. Like and if just pet food in general, it's like a religion. There's a lot of very strong opinions. There's a lot of, you know, just people say crazy shit too, you know.
Speaker 2:Constantly will get comments about people, you know, questioning, you know, they'll watch we have an origin story video. I don't I think you guys have seen it where we talk about, you know, how my sister started it and how the family has carried it on. And people will say horrible things. It's like, for a long time, I didn't wanna put that story out there because I didn't wanna be it makes you more vulnerable to that stuff. But I also was like, it's so important for people to know this because, you know, a lot of companies say they were founded on, oh, well, you know, here's my authentic origin story.
Speaker 2:And I'm not saying those don't exist, but this is really truly this wasn't founded because somebody wanted to get rich quick or had a great, like, entrepreneurial idea. It was because somebody wanted to do better for their own animals. And out of that, a business opportunity presented itself. Yeah. And that's why it's here today.
Speaker 2:And it's it's still very much a part of the company, that that ethos and that, you know, philosophy.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Amy, prior to you becoming, like, chief branding officer for We Feed Raw, what what were you doing before that?
Speaker 2:So I was a write I'm a writer by trade. Okay. I was before that working at a fashion company as a copywriter. Kenneth Cole is the name of the fashion company, which is kind of an it was a fun
Speaker 1:I didn't even know that one.
Speaker 2:I feel like a lot of guys were like, know it from like the suits and the Yeah. Rare toe loafers or something. But, yeah, it was a great place to be a copywriter in fashion because they have like a very strong sociopolitical message to all of their, you know, headlines. And so it was more interesting than, you know, just regular fashion copywriting. But yeah, I wrote for magazines, I was a copywriter for other places, I wrote a book when I was in my, I guess, was it late twenties about living with roommates after college that was published by Simon and Schuster.
Speaker 2:Don't get it. It's gonna like have really
Speaker 3:to read that.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Link link in the show notes.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. It's like, I think you can get it used for like 2¢ on Amazon. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Have you seen your fingerprint from that marketing experience on how you've been able to transition into We Feed Raw?
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah. Completely. I mean, I was very much a part of like with when we worked with the creative agency here, like I was a very much a part of what we decided on and how, you know, we've carried it through. And it's it's we've iterated on it since then too. I mean, and it evolves all the time, but that's I'm fiercely protective of the brand.
Speaker 2:I think it's really, really important. It might sound like superficial to people, but it's how people connect with the brand and trust the brand. And, you know, our story really has to be carried through all areas. So I'm have my hands on all of the media channels.
Speaker 3:Totally.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. We've so a lot of our podcasts started off kind of Harry and I trying to explore this thesis of, like, why humans evolutionarily are just designed to thrive on animal products. And it's, you know, taking the morality out of it just from a pure education standpoint, nutrition standpoint, why animal products are so nutrient dense and necessary for humans to really be able to thrive and live our best life. And in talking to some of these carnivore doctors, a few of them, notably Doctor Anthony Chaffee, was talking about the fact that dogs and cats are also evolutionarily carnivore too. And one of the things that he talked about is he saw this study or some type of research that pointed to the fact that the average lifespan of a Golden Retriever has significantly decreased over the last twenty years, and he his thesis was that it's diet.
Speaker 3:So in prepping for this conversation, I was like, average lifespan of dog over time. Yeah. I couldn't find anything on Google. Yeah. And then I was like, I typed in the question, like, are dogs evolutionarily carnivores?
Speaker 3:And the first four articles that pop up in SEO Mhmm. Are arguing why they're not carnivores, and all those articles are sponsored by, like, the largest grain based pet food companies. So you can't even find the right information out
Speaker 2:on that SEO now. But like, yes, it's it's crazy. I mean, the amount of so we don't even get into the carnivore omnivore debate, because clearly we we believe dogs are carnivores, they're facultative carnivores, they're scavenging carnivores. But like it's almost like people just go down this rabbit hole of like arguing about omnivore, carnivore. It's like, okay, at the end of the day, like whatever you wanna call them, they're meat eaters with no requirement for carbohydrates.
Speaker 2:Even AFCO who writes the laws for pet food in The US confirms that they have no requirement for carbohydrates. But then yet you have these kibble companies that are putting 40 to 70% carbs, cheap filler carbs, you know, cereal grains basically, in their diet. And we're expecting them to live, you know, long healthy lives. So it's it's I firmly believe that, you know, the state of dogs today and, you know, all of the diseases that they're getting and the fact that fifty three percent of them are obese or overweight is directly related to the starch heavy, crappy food they're being fed.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It seems like hospitals and also veterinary clinics have this like similar trend like when and obviously, there's a ton of bias in there. But when I go to a veterinary clinic, it seems like there's almost no healthy dogs.
Speaker 2:Well, definitely not. Yeah. I mean, I I think like when people a lot of not to say that if you have a raw fed dog, and I always like make this clear. You feed your dog a raw diet, doesn't mean they're going to live forever or never get sick. Right?
Speaker 2:We we're not it's just going to give them the best chance at a happy, healthy life. Right? I don't I do think, though, that raw fed dogs or dogs that are fed a biologically appropriate diet don't have to go to the vet as much. They're not also, a lot of our clients tell us that when they go to their vets, they don't even tell them that they're feeding a raw diet because they don't wanna deal with, the backlash of it. I have, like, a funny story, but I don't know if you guys heard about the the whole DCM thing.
Speaker 2:Do you know what was going on?
Speaker 1:No. You were telling me about this.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So DCM is an acronym for dilated cardiomyopathy, which is like a condition in which the heart muscle becomes enlarged and it's potentially fatal. It's a very serious thing. So in 02/2018, a bunch of vets reported that there was an uptick in DCM, and they assumed that it was connected to the popularity of grain free diets. Now there's two types of grain free diets.
Speaker 2:Right? There's the ones that are modified to be grain free Mhmm. And the ones that are naturally grain free, like raw diets. Right? The ones that are modified to grain be grain free, they don't they they they learned that people these pet food manufacturers learned that people didn't want grains in their pet foods pet's diet.
Speaker 2:So they took the grains out, but they didn't replace them with animal protein. They replaced them with more carbs just in, like, you know, legume form. So all of a sudden, have, like, you know, pea protein, all of the chickpeas as, like, main ingredients. In large proportions, dogs aren't designed to process those. It still has not been confirmed that that's linked to it, but I believe that it will eventually come out that there's probably some connection with these, like, legume ingredients and high proportions that are anti nutrients contributing to dogs getting DCM.
Speaker 2:Anyways, the point is vets have, like, taken every it it, like, created this shitstorm of people going crate like, oh my gosh. Like, I've been feeding grain free, and then everything everything grain free got lumped into this category, including naturally grain free diets, raw diets. So we still, to this day, have people, like, constantly asking us, like, but don't I have to add grains to my dog's diet? Even though the FDA has recently released, you know, a statement saying we have found no causal link between diet and DCM. Wow.
Speaker 2:And especially in raw diets were never implicated, but vets implicated them. So my brother recently took his German Shepherd to the vet. I think his German Shepherd is, like, gonna be nine. He's been eating raw his whole life, raw. And when he was in there, the vet was asking, oh, what are you feeding?
Speaker 2:And he told him a raw diet. And the vet said, you should just start adding some rice to that diet. And my brother was like, why? Oh, well, there's research coming out that's proving that dogs are getting DCM when they don't have grains in their diet. And my brother happens to be an ortho an ortho surgeon, so he's very adept at reading clinical research.
Speaker 2:He's like, can you send me the or tell me where I can read the study? So the vet told him and when he left the room, my brother was googling it. And the study said nothing about about raw diets or naturally grain free diets being linked to DCM, it did say that there might be some link with, you know, legume heavy grain free diets. So when he said this to the vet, he was like, there's nothing in here that says anything about raw diets having the vet said, oh, I didn't read the whole study. I just read the title.
Speaker 2:And, like, these are the people that are giving information to I mean, they're they're the ones who are disseminating the information. And why wouldn't you trust your vet? But, like, my brother happens to, a, know a lot about raw feeding, b, be a doctor and, like, know how to read these studies. So it's just like so I mean, that's just my brother too. That's someone I know that happened to telling me that story.
Speaker 2:So, like, how many other times is this happening? It's just infuriating.
Speaker 3:Because we have this can we talk about this a lot in human medicine. We have this condition doctor patient practice where it's like, if a doctor recommends something, you just blanket follow whatever they say. Yeah. So if your brother's like the one orthopedic surgeon out of a 100 patients that this vet has, 99 other people are definitely gonna just follow what he says and just give their dog rice.
Speaker 2:Totally. Right. Even though even another orthopedic surgeon who didn't read raw might do the same. You know what
Speaker 3:I mean?
Speaker 2:Like, wouldn't even read the study. You just like, okay. This vet, I trust that he's done the research to, you know, give me the act accurate information.
Speaker 1:So Yeah.
Speaker 2:Just insane. So
Speaker 1:When did the ingredients for dog food or just how we were feeding our dogs change? Because when I was going through, like, okay, I got Sunny in July of last year
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I'm going through the pet store and reading the labels like a psycho, and I'm like, there's seed oils in all of this, there's grains in all of this, and I know that these aren't good for humans, and I'm assuming that, like, dogs biologically react negatively to those highly processed oils and grains just similarly as as humans as well. So there had to have been a turning point, I'm assuming.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So basically, the first pet food, like the dry dog biscuit, was invented in like 1860
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:By not a vet or an animal nutritionist or anything, it was just a businessman actually who saw like sailors throwing hardtack, which is like processed food, over the ship and stray dogs were eating it. He was like, oh, I had a lightbulb moment. Like, I'm gonna invent so that that happened. And then kibble was actually not even invented until 1954. So this is what I like try to get through people's heads.
Speaker 2:It's like, dogs did not lose the like, their ability to digest their evolutionary diet just because kibble came along less than a 100 years ago. Like, that is not the way evolution works. Right. I mean, some experts say it takes at least a hundred thousand years for a dog to change its dietary needs. But yeah.
Speaker 2:So before that though, dogs were you know, they might not have been eating like a complete and balanced raw diet, but they were eating real food. They were eating table scraps. They were eating scraps from the butcher. They were eating whatever the families were eating that was like leftover. Right?
Speaker 2:So that's way better than what they're eating now, which is like highly processed carb heavy stuff, you know. And I also say, you know, just because dogs weren't eating a complete and balanced raw diet necessarily like, you know, that entire time, that is the best. That is the optimal diet. That is what they're designed to eat and digest. Right?
Speaker 2:Right. They have been living and surviving on that from the beginning of time, since the dawn of their existence, for millennia. It is literally what they are designed to derive their nutrients from. So when you introduce, you know, all of these carbs to them in a food, it's just like it makes no sense. The ancestral diet had virtually no grains.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. You know? Yeah. So it's just really crazy. We we our nutritionist that we work with just says, like, an you know, a lifetime of excess carbs is so damaging to a dog's health, and yet we're feeding them a lifetime
Speaker 3:of people. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's all we're feeding them day in and day out. And we really We Feed Raw. We're we try to be we used to be a lot more severe with this approach, but we really try to say, as long as you're feeding some fresh raw food. It can get cost prohibitive if you have like a bunch of huge dogs in the home. Right?
Speaker 2:Like, you can't feed a 100% raw, but just feed some. It's way better. And like, it's not just like not some kibble isn't going to be so harmful to your dog. It's really not. But day in, only kibble, day in and day out will be.
Speaker 2:And we we're seeing that.
Speaker 3:Right. Yeah. So you
Speaker 1:see the difference between eating cereal all the time Yes. Versus having some cereal and meat as Exactly.
Speaker 2:Like imagine feeding your kid, you know, dry cereal. They would survive, but if you but they would be really unhealthy. Totally. And they can talk to you at least. They'd like, my stomach hurts or whatever.
Speaker 2:Like, dogs just they eat what we give them. And they you know, even people are like, oh, my dog loves their kibble. I'm sure they do. It's like junk food. Right?
Speaker 2:It's sprayed with all sorts of flavorings. It's packed with delicious cheap carbs, you know? Like Yeah. It tastes good to them. Although I have to say, like, most people when they switch to raw are like, oh my god, my dog is gobbling up the food.
Speaker 2:I think they prefer that. But dogs can get addicted to to kibble.
Speaker 3:Just like humans.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And on that parallel, did did Eisenhower have his heart attack in 1954 or 1945? Do you remember?
Speaker 1:I think it was I think it was late fifties
Speaker 3:Yeah. Essentially. It would be crazy if it was the same year, because you said Kibble was invented in '54. That would be Have you heard the Eisenhower No. Heart attack story?
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 3:So it was either 1945 or 1954, Eisenhower had a heart attack, and so he was out of the Oval Office for, like, six days or something like that, and the stock market had one of the biggest crashes since, like, the Great Depression up to that point. And this scientist named Ansel Keyes out of University of Minnesota believed that it was saturated fat that caused his heart attack. Okay. So he basically launched this crusade on saturated fat and organized this, like, seven country study where he took seven different countries and basically showed their consumption of saturated fat and their overall incident instance instances of heart disease. So when you look at the seven countries that he plotted, it shows like a perfect one to one correlation.
Speaker 3:But there were 28 other countries in that study that did not it showed a little bit of correlation, but obviously a little bit of correlation doesn't mean causation. Right. But he didn't release those other those 21 other countries. Picked
Speaker 2:the data.
Speaker 3:Exactly. And they launched this entire saturated fat crusade, then you start to see more of like the introduction of vegetable oils, the American Heart Association gets like a $1,200,000 donation from Procter and Gamble that created Crisco. Wow. So if if it's the same year, that would be wild. But either way, there's still this like ten year window where both humans and pets were eating this like evolutionarily consistent diet Yeah.
Speaker 3:And that's really when we start to see the introduction of processed foods. And, like, our like, obesity, like you said, the obesity rate of pets is like fifty percent plus. And I would have to think the cancer rate of dogs is even higher than humans too, because I feel like every dog that I know of, like, dies of cancer.
Speaker 2:They said fifty percent of dogs will get cancer after the age of 10. Six million dogs a year die of cancer. It's like really crazy. Like, that's not norm we're just like people just like assess my dog is the average lifespan is you know, I had an English bulldog for a while, and she lived until she was 12 years old, which is long for an English bulldog. Right?
Speaker 2:Everyone's like, oh, she's only gonna make it to eight. And I was like, you know, she ate a raw diet. She had none of the English bulldog, you know, typical problems that you would see. Like, she wasn't overweight. She did mean, of course, the way that they're like, she had she snored a little.
Speaker 2:But I mean, she was really a healthy, fast, you know, bulldog that and every time we'd take her to the vet, they're like, this is the healthiest bulldog we've ever seen. Like, oh, the raw diet. Oh, nothing. You know, crickets. Yeah.
Speaker 1:If a bulldog's not snoring, they're
Speaker 2:not happy. Yeah. I know. It's a sign of happiness.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It it's amazing. I also wonder too, like, with the environmental toxins that dogs might encounter at a higher level than humans, like glyphosate, for instance. Yeah. Roundup is sprayed on everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like, even people's lawns, like, you know, they spray to kill all the weeds, your then dog goes and runs around outside on that.
Speaker 2:And, like, it
Speaker 1:can't be good for them.
Speaker 2:I mean, they're dealing with a lot of stuff, but I think the first the biggest offender is what we're feeding them.
Speaker 1:I mean,
Speaker 3:if
Speaker 2:we just started there, I I mean, dogs aren't supposed to die as soon as we have to rethink all of this stuff. Yeah. People it's the craziest brainwashing I've ever seen.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's smart people that are just like not even the vets. I mean, I hate to go after the vets because they're we think vets are wonderful. They're doing a great job. Our nutritionist says, you know, vets fix broken animals. Nutritionists stop them from getting broken in the first place.
Speaker 2:Right? But it's like they've sort of just tried to own the nutrition piece of it, and it's not fair because you haven't really been educated or given all of the unbiased information. They, you know, are are learning about nutrition from kibble funded studies only. So I mean, we have we are seeing a shift here. We we work with conventional vets, not holistic.
Speaker 2:I mean, we work with holistic vets too. But we are getting approached by conventional vets who want to feed our food. We have one conventional vet. She went to UC Davis. She's like an amazing vet.
Speaker 2:She was not taught about this in vet school. And she has like her dogs and agility training on the weekends. So she was seeing all these other dogs that were like amazing athletes. And she was like, what are they eating? And they're all eating raw diet.
Speaker 2:So she switched her dog. Her dogs were suffering from all sorts of stuff on kibble. She switched them and they've been eating our food for like almost two years now. Yeah. You know?
Speaker 2:Conventional vet who wasn't taught about
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Any of this in vet school. So
Speaker 3:Mhmm. It's almost like you need to have that anecdotal experience to make you desperate enough to be able to make the switch to see the benefits for yourself.
Speaker 2:It's true. I think, like, it's tough for vets too because like imagine you've you went to vet they they they all want the best for dogs. I really don't buy into like that they're trying to like, you know, get kickbacks from I I just don't think it's that. I think that they didn't learn about it in vet school. And then, you you know, you're very attached to what you have learned.
Speaker 2:And there's a lot of these vets that see raw diets gone wrong, you know. Like people are trying to do it themselves. And not to say that you can't do it yourself, but sometimes people just think crazy things or, like, just feeding hamburger meat with nothing else or so they might see the bad side of it. They're also completely obsessed with the bacteria part of it, which I don't know. I just think it's, like, pretty crazy because dogs are designed.
Speaker 2:They have like, if you look at their anatomy, all you have to do is look at their biological makeup and it will tell you what they're supposed to be eating. They have short, simple digestive tracts, high level of hydrochloric acid in their stomachs Mhmm. Sharp teeth. I mean, they can eat lots of things. Right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. They can eat their own shit. And they're gonna be fine. But for some I always say too, like, have people see their dogs sometimes, like, your dog will kill a squirrel or like a are you rushing the animal to the vet after that? Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's like so like, but, oh my gosh. If they eat a piece of raw meat, like, they're all gonna die. So I think that the bacteria thing is obviously, dogs can handle bacteria in ways that we cannot. Mhmm. We do the FDA, I don't know if you guys know this, but they have a zero tolerance policy on pathogenic bacteria in all pet food.
Speaker 3:Interesting.
Speaker 2:Raw food is included in that. So in order to deal with that, we use something called cold pressure processing. It's a natural it's used on a lot of people foods. You guys know about it in people. So it's used on cold like, juices, raw milks, lots of meats and fishes, fishes.
Speaker 2:It's it's really you baby food. It's used ubiquitously in people food. It's become like this crazy controversial topic in raw feeding. But it's a great way to be compliant because it allows us to it's natural. It doesn't use heat, doesn't use chemicals, it doesn't use non natural additives.
Speaker 2:It basically uses extreme cold water pressure to inactivate potentially harmful pathogens. But it doesn't inactivate it still keeps the enzymes of interest alive. So it's not a dead food, it's not a sterile food. But, yeah, it's it's it's it's a crazy I I always say like if if the problem that vets have is the pathogenic bacteria, then like any big raw pet food company in The US is using this. Wow.
Speaker 2:So that's addressing that problem. Right? And it's we're not doing this because we think that the dogs can't handle it without it, but it is a safe way for human the people feeding it. So if you have children and small children in the home, immunocompromised people in the home, elderly people in the home, it is a safe way because dogs are eating it on the floor. They might be getting it, you know, on things and Right.
Speaker 2:It's it's a nice way to be able to be compliant. Mhmm.
Speaker 1:So for someone who just switched their dog over to a raw food diet Yeah. I imagine you guys see so many different reviews and customer success stories. But what are what are like the favorite ones that you like to hear about from your customers?
Speaker 2:Yeah. At Olekosh, we have so many. There was one recently that a lady who was like, your food has like changed our lives. Her dog was only I think it was eight months old, a pit bull covered in hives, like all his fur. Like, she sent us pictures.
Speaker 2:It was like so sad. He was just losing all of his fur. He was having crazy allergies. He was getting allergy shots and steroid shots once a month. Nothing was working.
Speaker 2:So one of the influencers that we work with who also has two big pit bulls, this woman followed her and asked her which you know, about our food. And so she switched her dog. And the dog is like, all his fur grew back. He doesn't have to get any of the allergy shots. Like, all of his symptoms are I mean, he's still like, his fur is still they're still a little bit patchy, but he's basically healed.
Speaker 2:Yeah. You know, from food. And and it's just crazy that that was never an option that was given to them from the conventional, you know, side.
Speaker 1:One of my favorite sound bites from our podcast was with the regenerative farmer out of Virginia, Joel Salatin. Yeah. And he talks about how the health care costs in The US and food costs make up about 30% of a US person's budget. And over time, the cost of health care, it used to be like 10% like about a 100 years ago. And the other 20% was made up from food costs.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And that has inversed over time where now we're spending 20% on health care and 10% on food. And you guys must run into that a bunch just like seeing the effects of eat paying a little more bit more upfront for raw food, but then people not having to spend so much on veterinary bills, which are insane.
Speaker 2:It's so true, but it's so hard to get people to think that way. I know. It's amazing. I'm like, okay, You're paying more? We just did something today where I was talking with the team and it was like, what's the point of of budgeting less for healthy food if you're just gonna end up paying more for your dog's illnesses?
Speaker 2:Like, if that's what happens. But like it's hard to think that far ahead. And also, people just get caught it's like, I call it a reallocation of funds. So it's like, you don't have a you have a problem paying this much money for pet food, but you don't have a problem paying thousands of dollars to get this tumor removed. Like, all of these allergy shots or these like, all of the things that come along.
Speaker 2:It's like they have so much more allocated for vet care than food. And it really doesn't have to be that way. But I think because it's, like, hard for people to see you know, they're so microscopic, it's like, okay. And also your vet is telling you, get a new dog, you go to the vet. I wanna feed my dog a raw diet.
Speaker 2:I mean, I cannot tell you how many clients could say to us, like, get so excited. They're gonna feed, then they go to the vet and they're like, my vet's telling me not to do this. It's like really dangerous. It's gonna make my family sick. It's gonna make the dog sick.
Speaker 2:And so we have to, like, talk them off a ledge every single I mean, it's just it's crazy. So, yeah, I don't know how to there there's obviously a sticker shock with our product. You know, people get mad at us. They're like, you're ripping people off. You're greedy.
Speaker 2:And I'm like, we were greedy, believe me, we would not get into the raw food. Totally. Like the margins are just not there. Okay? Kibble is always gonna have better margins than this.
Speaker 2:Quality costs more. Our food costs what it costs. Because, like, we're using USDA, human grade meats. Like, nothing is rendered like, it's like no filler. You know?
Speaker 2:This is just it's real food. So I just think people I don't know. I think that they've been trained to to expect to pay a certain amount for your dog and anything above that is greedy or astronomical, you know.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah. I think you guys should do a whole PR campaign around this concept of reallocation of funds, honestly, because I think it's that powerful. Yeah. The term that we we typically use is, like, viewing food as like a holistic asset, which is the same thing. It's not like you're paying $10 for regenerative beef versus $4 grocery store beef because you know it's gonna make you healthier, you're gonna lose weight, you're gonna have more energy, you're gonna make more money, you're gonna be able play with your kids.
Speaker 3:Literally, an asset that keeps on generating stuff for you over time. But reallocation of funds is essentially the same thing, where it's like, this this price is like, you are gonna pay it. It's like you either can pay some of it upfront, or you could pay a lot more in the back end. But the choice is ultimately yours. But there's like so much rewiring of human psychology that we I need to do,
Speaker 2:know. And I think, like, like I'm obviously, you know, you know, going through I was always a healthy eater and just a healthy person in general, always interested in health and wellness. But when my sister got sick, it's a whole new, you know, journey of, you know, discovering things. And also, you know, we were all trying all these diet. My sister did raw vegan for a while, which is like, you know, I'm not a vegan and I I but I do think cutting out all processed food feel better.
Speaker 2:Right? Yes. So, I mean, I I've experienced the power of food myself. And it's not an overnight thing. Right?
Speaker 2:You it's like, it's sort of like turning the temperature up in a room. Like, you're like, oh, wow. Like, this is amazing. Like, I feel better now. I think I feel better than, like, I did a month ago.
Speaker 2:And then it's like sort of builds on itself. But people in our society, it's like, they want instantaneous, you know, results. They wanna see, like and that doesn't happen with healthy eating or healthy food. It's not gonna happen with your dog. You're not gonna feed your dog raw in one meal, and then everything's gonna be cured the next day.
Speaker 2:But you can go to the vet and get like a shot and it will maybe cover up the symptoms for a while and, you know, so I think it's it's hard. You have to have patience. You have to just have that mindset. And I don't think people even have it for themselves. The majority of people don't necessarily have it for themselves.
Speaker 3:So how are you supposed to have it for your pet if
Speaker 2:you don't
Speaker 3:have it for yourself? Yeah. So for the concerned pet owner that's like, maybe their dog is on kibble now and they're really interested in what you're saying and they're like, damn, I'm interested in making a switch. Yeah. What are those like core foods or ingredients that you're incorporating into WeFeed Raw that like everyone should be incorporating for their pets?
Speaker 2:Okay. So, well, we offer a complete and balanced product. So it's based on the ancestral diet, which is roughly, like, 80% muscle meat with connective tissue and fat, 10% organ meat, all of which is secreting organ, and 10% finely ground raw meaty bones. So, I mean, it's hard to tell something like that is great. Right?
Speaker 2:Try to find a complete and balanced raw brand. It's easier. It's very hard to, you know, do DIY raw. I know people do it, but I'm like, man, I I wouldn't do it even if I didn't have But to it's like, it's freaking hard. You have to have a grinder.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's just so I I think that if you can start, that's obviously the best. Right? But adding any fresh food to your dogs, like, even if it's something you're eating, like, just give them something fresh and whole that isn't a dried, carb heavy, highly processed, cooked to obscene temperatures, hell it. You know? Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So that can be anything from adding even like a little hamburger meat or adding some steamed vegetables or, you know, just fresh food. Yeah. You can start there. I mean, either they say even 10% of fresh food can have a huge difference on your dog's longevity. But, yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, those are the best thing is to try to mimic what they ate in the wild. That's going to give them the best chance. And our nutritionist that we work with, you know, he says that people ask him, you know, okay, he'll give lectures and someone will say, you know, my dog is 14 and has cancer. Like, what should I be feeding them? And he's like, I obviously never say this to them at the time, but what the sentiment is is like, this should have been a question you were asking fourteen years ago.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. You know? Not now.
Speaker 2:Not now. And it's sad for these people because they want, you know. And like a lot of people that are feeding kibble don't they want the best for their dogs. They're just not don't have the information. And yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, but the best thing you could do for your dog is start them as early as possible on a diet that nature has decided is best for them.
Speaker 3:You know?
Speaker 2:We use nature as a guide.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's the best thing that you can do.
Speaker 1:Okay. I have to ask you this question because I'm so curious if you've heard it before. So when I started when I got Sunny, she was feeding her she was being fed a raw diet, and then there's like a three week period where I fed her kibble because I was moving around a bunch. And I noticed that she drank so much more water when she was on a kibble diet, and I got her back on the raw food diet, and she really doesn't it doesn't seem like she needs water at all almost. Like, it's actually kind of strange, like unless she goes out and plays, fetch for a long time, she comes back in, needs water.
Speaker 1:Yep. But otherwise, she really doesn't. Have you heard that?
Speaker 2:Yes. It's like one of the biggest concerns people have when they start feeding raw. They're like, my dog isn't drinking water. Like, what's wrong? So dogs are designed to get their moisture from their food, not their water bowls.
Speaker 2:I mean, yes, of course, we still want them to drink from their water bowls, but kibble is about six to 12% moisture. Mhmm. Raw is about 70% moisture. They're really getting all of the moisture they need from their food with just like, yeah, some drinking from the water bowl and if it's hotter, more drinking. But, you know, dogs and cats especially are chronically dehydrated when they're on a dry food diet because especially cats, they really are designed to get their moisture from their food.
Speaker 2:So
Speaker 1:It was noticeable. Like, when she was on kibble, she needed water immediately after Yeah. Like, throughout the day she needed it more. So I saw that and I was like, this is so it's like a cool little experiment.
Speaker 2:Totally. I know people like, it's we have to actually warn people of this because they get concerned that there's something wrong with their dog because they're not drinking. And it's it's really happens pretty fast.
Speaker 3:Well, now you know. Yeah. 70% moisture. That's incredible.
Speaker 2:Yeah. 70% moisture. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Wow. I I was watching this documentary like a year ago called it's called the Magic Pill. Okay. It's free on YouTube, everyone should check it out.
Speaker 3:It basically talks about why saturated fat and animal products are so healthy and so essential for humans. And one of the things that talks about in the beginning is how humans are the only species in the any or the only species that doesn't know what to eat, which is so interesting. It's super humbling too, because it's like, all the scientific advancements we've made, all the technology, and we don't know what to eat compared to anything else in the wild. And I'm like, that's technically not true because it's humans and then also like domesticated pets as well.
Speaker 2:That's true. What what they but if we left them out in the wild, they probably would choose to eat, you know. I mean, dogs tend to be less good at being predators than cats, for example. Guess that's sort of historically, like, true. But, yeah, I feel like if you give a dog a it depends though.
Speaker 2:You know, it's hard to say like, oh, give a dog a bowl of raw meat or give a dog a bowl of kibble, what will they eat? Because if they're addicted to kibble, there might be a chance that they would eat the kibble. Because it does taste good to them. You know, it is junk food. And sometimes one of the biggest problems we have transitioning, we always say the pet parent because they're harder than the dog sometimes.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. But these dogs will turn their noses up at it at first because they have no idea they're like, have been conditioned to think that this dry other food that's sprayed with all sorts of, like, flavor enhancers and additives is food. And then what is this other stuff that's, like, usually a colder temperature? It's really strong smelling with, like, organ meat. It's not always an instant, like, oh, yes.
Speaker 2:This is my ancestral food. You know, dogs don't always have that. So we have to, like, walk people through it. And a lot of people don't have the patience or persistence, and we have to remind them that dogs will not starve themselves. Like, if you are providing them food, they will eventually eat.
Speaker 2:Just stick with it. But a lot of people won't because they're just like, oh, there must my dog was not not like raw, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I remember when I was growing up, the the we got a dog and the breeder was recommending a raw food diet and there was so much opposition to it. And I remember my mom was just like, yeah, there's like no way we're gonna feed our dog a raw diet.
Speaker 2:She afraid of the bacteria?
Speaker 1:I think it was more so like the bacteria and actually like handling raw food. Yeah. But I remember hearing that and being like, it kind of it makes sense, like these dogs would have been eating, you know, scraps of of kills that we would have like evolutionarily Yeah. Evolved with them and they would have been eating, you know, kind of things that we would have killed.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, they're they're we've bred dogs for their looks, their behavior, and their temperament, but their digestive systems and form and function are identical to their ancestors. Like, that's has not changed. So there's like no reason they shouldn't be eating exactly what, like, they were eating, you know.
Speaker 1:One of my favorite things on the Internet is seeing the meme pictures of dogs just laying in the sun. And it really, like, reminds me so much of just like the parallels between dogs and humans and the things that we've gotten wrong. Yeah. Like dogs dogs naturally intuitively like just go to the window and sit in the place where it's sunny. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like this is amazing. They're just doing what they're supposed to do. Yeah. And it just I think the best part about this conversation is the fact that so much of it can be applied to human health too.
Speaker 2:Totally.
Speaker 1:Like, all these different, like, angles on improving a dog's health can be applied back to humans and vice versa.
Speaker 2:Totally. And like, just keep it simple. Like, every it's like, doesn't have to be so complicated.
Speaker 1:You
Speaker 2:know? Like, that's the thing that people get wrong. And, like, I think also the pet food big pet food has done an amazing job of scaring people away from feeding anything real. It's like, if it doesn't come from this perfectly scientifically formulated bag that we're selling you, do not feed it to your dog.
Speaker 3:Like Totally.
Speaker 2:All of our articles that we do on our blog, like, can my dog eat x? Whatever that is. Can my dog eat bananas? Can my dog eat raw eggs? Can my dog they're like the most clicked on article.
Speaker 2:People are ups like, googling all the time because they're so people are so afraid to feed their dog anything.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right? And pet that was like a big marketing campaign when kibble was introduced was like because what were people feeding before that? They were feeding table scraps. So they had to think about a way to like scare people away from like feeding that way. Right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So it's it's lasted and it's like so strong to this day. You know.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And there's so much greenwashing
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:In pet food just like there is with human food too. Like, we're talking about that brand, Blue Buffalo, not to shit on any brands in particular, but like, they're advocating that for this like chicken based dog food. And it's really like they're like, oh, chicken is ingredient number one. And there's like 60 other ingredients in there too, but they're leading with chicken first.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And it's probably chicken meal. I don't know. I haven't
Speaker 3:heard It is chicken meal.
Speaker 2:So do you guys know about meat meals? No. No. Okay. So I always say there's three big things wrong with kibble.
Speaker 2:The first one is that it's biologically it's not appropriate. The second one is that they're using very low quality ingredients. And the third one is that it's highly highly processed. So the low quality ingredients. The ingredients in kibble, the protein source that they first, it's packed with cheap fillers.
Speaker 2:Okay? That's like cheap filler carbohydrates. That's like the big problem. Then they use plant derived protein. So that comes from, you know, chickpeas, peas, lentils, and then they use rendered animal protein.
Speaker 2:So rendering is a very interesting kind of a dark hole to go down. But rendering is the process of recycling raw animal material, grinding it up, cooking it in a big vat like a stew, and then drying it to create this like powdery substance that's then sold as a protein source to for animal feed or to pet food manufacturers for dog food. The obviously, that's like it's, you know, very, very, very processed. The quality of the meat is usually not very good. And then there's named byproduct meals.
Speaker 2:So if you see on a label like chicken byproduct meal, beef byproduct meal, turkey byproduct meal, those legally all have to have the name of the animal in the meal. There's also generic generically named byproduct meals. That's when it gets like pretty dicey and disgusting. So those can have any animal in them. So these rendering plants, there's not a lot of like safety or quality checking going on.
Speaker 2:They're kind of just collecting animals from all different places. So that could be diseased and dying farm animals that can be euthanized horses and pigs that can even be euthanized pets with, like, the collars still on and ID tags still on. They're like in the plastic bags. They don't take those off when they're throwing them in the grinder. Everything just gets thrown in there.
Speaker 2:And so that's why you'll sometimes see these headlines where it's like dog DNA found in, like, two new dog foods. And it's like, how do you think the dog DNA is getting in there? The pet food manufacturers aren't like, scooping up dogs and like but, you know, they're buying the rendered protein that then has these other animals in it. So it's pretty scary, the rendered animal
Speaker 3:protein. Wow. Is the rendering is that rendering happening in The US or is it primarily like China or other countries?
Speaker 2:No. I mean, it's happening here. There's all like independent rendering plants and it seems like they kind of can do you know, there's a lot of it's pretty controversial because like, it's a very effective way of recycling. Right? What are you doing with all this waste?
Speaker 2:Right? It's going gotta go somewhere. So, you know, I don't know. I'm still not gonna feed my dog with that. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:But a lot of it is a effective form of recycling. Right?
Speaker 3:Mhmm. So
Speaker 1:You just made me think of something. Culturally, are there any cultures, countries that feed their dogs differently than we do in The US?
Speaker 2:That's a really good question. So I found that, like, in Australia, they're like a lot more forward. They're like farther like the the raw food market takes up like a bigger percentage of the market share. I think The US is probably like farther behind. I think like Europeans just tend to be more open minded about that stuff too.
Speaker 2:So I don't know all the statistics. But but, yeah, I I think America's pretty dismal as far as like, you know, the way that we kibble like, kibble is just a it's a behemoth industry.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Behemoth. Like, we are just a sliver of the market. Right.
Speaker 1:And the four sponsored ads that you talked about. I mean, it's like tough to fight that battle when there's so much money being pushed on, like, against the the truth.
Speaker 2:So much and like so much fear. I mean, and it makes like, when you think about it, like, yes, of course, when you explain raw to people and the raw diet, like, just for, like, five minutes, it does click. Right? It makes intuitive sense. But the bacteria thing is also, like, a great argument.
Speaker 2:It scares a lot. You're like, oh, gosh. Yes. Because we have so much fear about, like, bacteria chicken and, like, you know, it's like, oh my god. You know?
Speaker 2:I think that it really is an effective way to scare people away from it because and it's just I don't wanna say that it can't happen. Right? But, like, we're all company. Like, it's just we're not seeing that. People aren't, like, getting sick and, like, their animals are it's people are they wash their hands.
Speaker 2:Like, use basic hygiene practices with, like, just as you would especially if you're buying from a reputable company that's using like, has quality sourcing, it's really easy to feed raw safely. You know? You have to be cognizant that you're feeding raw and wash your hands and wash the bowls and, like but that's it. It doesn't really require much else.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. I can't believe how unregulated those processing facilities are. So, like, you're saying
Speaker 2:great. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Horses, other dogs, pigs, these like diseased animals, and they're just legally able to mix these things into a turn them into a meal.
Speaker 2:And I'm not really sure of like all the laws, but like I do know that the FDA does say that animals that weren't killed for food aren't supposed to be used in food. But somehow there's like this loophole where because I I don't I think it's really hard to check the actual finished dried powder protein source. Right? Right. So I I guess maybe the rendering plants don't have, you know, that monitoring that.
Speaker 2:And again, it's like a very effective recycling method and it's, you know, where is all of that stuff gonna go?
Speaker 1:Mhmm. Who are some of the best resources out there? We talked about Doctor. Ian Bellinghurst, who's amazing. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Are there any other resources that you can think of that are helpful for people to kind of unpack this whole philosophy around raw food?
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, I I think like it's helpful to like follow all the raw companies too, like on on social and we're we're all kind of in this together So it's like a very small business. It's not saturated. So we always if there's like one, you know, a recall for one raw company, it would be bad for all raw companies. I think that the more, like, count more, come.
Speaker 2:Like, we need more. Because it it's really hard. It's a heavy lift to do this education. So I think following the raw companies, doctor Karen Becker wrote The Forever Dog with Rodney Habib. I don't know if you guys have heard of that book.
Speaker 2:Was like a it is a New York Times bestseller. It's really good. It's it's easy to understand and very thorough. Yeah. I mean, there's lots of I'm trying to think who else are you know, even like the the the better for you pet food brands that might not like, there's a Doctor.
Speaker 2:Harvey's who does like pet food supplements. Like, all of these people are pro raw, but just feeding your dog better, just thinking differently about what we feed our animals. Just I think, you know, I don't know. I'm we're an online brand, so we rely heavily on social. So I'm not always about, you know, I think there's a lot of education that can happen on there.
Speaker 2:So
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Are there are you encouraged by the trends that you're seeing with like the pet food industry? Like, do you think we're just gonna continue to see more and more pet owners that are switching towards the the raw diet?
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's hard to say because like and you asked me the question like, when did you go down the raw food raw food rabbit hole? And I'm like, I'm in the raw food rabbit hole every day.
Speaker 3:Every all day every day.
Speaker 2:All day. Come down and visit. It's crazy. Like, when you're right. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I do think that it's changing. It is I mean, so raw is the fastest growing segment of the pet food market, freeze dried raw. So that's very encouraging, but it's also a sliver still.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So I think that I'm also in this world, so it feels like, you know, yes, like people are I mean, our business is growing and doing really well and we continue to grow and that has to be a sign. And we have a very good lifetime value, which means the customer is sticking with us, the product's working. I think that this type of business has always been about word-of-mouth power, you know? Like, it's like they, you know, someone tries the food, they feed each other dog, they see the amazing benefits, and they want to share it. Like, we people become brand evangelists without us really doing much at all because it's an amazing thing.
Speaker 2:It's like Yeah. You guys, like, trying something that works for your health, you wanna share it. Right? You're like super So excited about the same thing happens with this. So I think that will always be a a big piece of it.
Speaker 2:And then, I guess, how to leverage that word-of-mouth power more.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's literally how you guys started. Right? It's like your sister believed in this thing so much. Yeah.
Speaker 3:You talk about like at the time, like a quote unquote unscalable business, like buying these super expensive ingredients, charging way more for it.
Speaker 1:Know.
Speaker 3:Sushi chef sushi chef processing it, hand delivering it in the Austin heat. But I was like know. That's how much she believed in this
Speaker 2:I know. And that really and like the people that were feeding at that time too were like, we call them like the fanatics, you know, which isn't really the customer you necessarily want. They're they're tough customers. They ask a million questions. They wanna know everything about the you know, they're like, nothing could be wrong ever.
Speaker 2:But they're the ones that we're so grateful for because they were there to believe in it when not, like, not a lot of people did. So, yeah. I mean, I I think that it's definitely there was a period when it we've had to make it more scalable. Right? My sister and Rich, they used to do like the grinds, which we do now, but they also did like the bones on the side if you wanted those.
Speaker 2:And then there was like, I don't know, like 12 different proteins. And then like all these different it used to be like based on sushi too. Like, not fish, but like they were sushi roll. I mean, it was just like too many different options and, you know, really fun and cute, but like it was it it wasn't scalable. So it's been through a few different iterations and people get mad at us still to this day.
Speaker 2:Like, oh, I wish they didn't take this away or didn't take that away. Or someone said the other day on a comment, now I kind of like, I don't laugh, but it definitely I've developed a much thicker skin because I think like, god, you have to just be like so messed up to say something like this. But one of the comments we got that one of my customer service, she's like, you wanna respond to this? And I'm like, I'll pass. But it was a comment on our origin story video and the woman was saying, you know, I I saw your video.
Speaker 2:It was so heartwarming. You've done such a good thing. But your prices are outrageous and you're so greedy and your sister would be so upset. Sad. It's like Wow.
Speaker 2:Okay. Well, my sister would want this to still be a business and not like out of business. So it's just, you know, it's just crazy, like some of the stuff. But
Speaker 1:Yeah. The internet brings out all the trolls
Speaker 3:and like Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:People who are just like
Speaker 2:Exposes them. Yeah. I know. I know. But, you know, it's it's definitely a sign of growth for me because again, I didn't tell the origin story for a long time.
Speaker 2:I had mixed feelings about it. I just didn't know if I wanted you know, it's a tough thing and I I don't necessarily want those types. I knew those comments would come.
Speaker 3:Yeah. You know? But
Speaker 2:now I can handle it and I I don't know. I I feel like I just sort of like, let it bother me for a second and then I'm over it.
Speaker 3:Yeah. We we found that when we launched Noble, there was one like, we got a lot of really positive response responses, and then there were also a lot of people that were like shitting on us for the price of the product. Yeah. And I'm like, well, it's like a premium product, so do you not want us to make money to keep like trying to push beef and animal protein into the market? It's a it's a same thing like you were saying.
Speaker 3:It's like, do you not want us to make money so we can keep fighting the good fight? I know. Spreading the message.
Speaker 2:I think people don't understand. And that's like, then people wanna tell you like how to run the business. I'm like, do you wanna see our PNL business? Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's it's really insane. I think and especially, yeah, you guys know that. I mean, it's like when you have a premium product, it's just the sticker shock is is really hard for people. And I think like, usually a premium product is not does not have the margins of, like, cheaper products out there. Right?
Speaker 2:They're the ones who are greedy. Go after that. Those are ones that are like so I don't know. I just feel like, you know, who the who's the guy that's founded Whole Foods? But he's as like, you know
Speaker 1:John Mackie.
Speaker 2:He's unapologetic about, know, you he's like, quality costs more. Yeah. Period. You know? There's nothing really I don't we could make our food cheaper, but then we'd have to add filler ingredients.
Speaker 2:We'd have
Speaker 3:to use like
Speaker 2:low grade meat. You know, there's lots of things that we could do.
Speaker 3:But
Speaker 1:Yeah. At the end of the at the end of the day, you vote with your dollars. And like, if you truly believe in a mission, like, yeah, there's some level of, you know, premium to that belief and the quality of life at the end of the day for your dog or if it's for your own health, buying better food, like that also does have positive effects.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. We get a lot of comments too about, oh, I could do this myself for cheaper. And it's like, that's great. Then do.
Speaker 2:You can't. Like, we are really all in favor of however you wanna feed raw. But this is for people that don't want to. You know, we're providing a service. And if you really believe that raw is best, then you would want that for other dogs too.
Speaker 2:And Mhmm. Like, I lived in New York City for eighteen years. I had no way I was gonna make raw myself. Like, you know, I what was I gonna do? Go to the butcher, have a grinder in my small apartment?
Speaker 2:Like, do all like, I couldn't even feasibly do it nor did I want to. You know? Yeah. So I think this is a great option. And like, it just allows us to get raw into more bowls.
Speaker 2:And it's gonna cost more than doing it yourself because we're providing a service. Totally. Guess what? That labor isn't free.
Speaker 3:You know? Yeah. Totally. Yeah. Living in New York really gives you appreciation for dog owners and how much you really wanna have a pet.
Speaker 3:Because I remember thinking because I was lived in New York for four years and I remember think I worked down in Fidei Yeah. And I remember thinking, oh, having a dog would be so cool. And then I would see, like, a dog take a crap right on the cobblestone on Wall Street and see the owner have to pick it up and I'm like, maybe I don't want a dog that much, actually.
Speaker 2:It's like freezing. I had well, when I lived in New York City, I had an English bulldog. So she was like, kinda like a house cat. Those I mean, she was really active and great, but like, she didn't really like love to do like, she was just like very cuddly and but, yeah. I mean, it's hard having a dog in New York City.
Speaker 2:But everything's hard in New
Speaker 3:York City. It really is. Yeah. Amy, one of the things that you'd said in the beginning that gave me goosebumps, I could tell Harry was reacting to it as well, is like, you were mentioning how there are a lot of moments where you really feel like your sister is with you. Mhmm.
Speaker 3:And if you're comfortable with me asking, I'm just curious, like, what were just some of like the favorite parts about her personality or just maybe like things that you learned from that you just try and, like, kinda bake into your own life and who you are as a person?
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, my sister and I were very close. Like, we were two years apart. She was my younger sister. You know, she was just an amazing, kind person.
Speaker 2:I know, like, everyone say that about their family members, but she really truly was. And she was such an out of the box thinker. In a way that I'm not even like, I I can think about how to make things look better, sound better. I'm good at the marketing part of it. But like she to come up with the idea and not that she invented raw feeding, but like to come up with this idea and to believe in it so firmly and to have such conviction and not need to have, you know, the backing of the masses.
Speaker 2:Like, it's just it's a unique type of person.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:She really was unique. And she was she was kind to people and she was kind to animals. And she was very, very smart. And I, like, you know, miss her obviously all the time. And this, you know, is I'm very dedicated to this.
Speaker 2:Sometimes my therapist and I talk about being pathologically dedicated. But it's it's good because I do getting back to the whole gift thing, I do feel like as, you know, there's been times and this was a hard business for a while, like, before we got funding, you know, it was very bootstrapped and there was a lot of scary times of like, are we gonna make it? And, you know, what are we gonna do? And like, you know, getting on my knees and being like, oh my god. Like, it it was stressful.
Speaker 2:And there was times when I was like, is this a gift or is it a curse? Like, I don't know. Like, it felt it felt like it could have been either sometimes. And I do ultimately feel like those are times are important. Right?
Speaker 2:Because it, like, it shows you, first of all, what you're made of. Mhmm. And, like, I do feel like one of the biggest gifts is, like, I don't know if you guys feel like this was your business and what you're doing, but having to push through that hard, like, I read a quote that said, like, just because something's hard doesn't mean it's wrong. You're doing it wrong.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:You know? Like and I feel like so many people abandon things because they're like, oh, it's hard. This must not be right. This not supposed to be this Right. No.
Speaker 2:Actually, like, some things are really fucking hard. Yeah. And if you push through it and you get to the other side, there's like a whole other world on that other side that like would not have been clear to you or visible to you unless you pushed through it. Yeah. And that's the biggest gift for me.
Speaker 2:It's like actually having sticking with it and not giving up.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. There's so much in fit there's so much faith involved with entrepreneurship that gosh. I know. It's like you you almost have to believe in magic entrepreneurship. You have to
Speaker 2:be a little freaking crazy. Like, you have to be like because there's so many there were so many people all along too. Even my own husband who's involved in the business now, he's like, what are we doing? Like Yeah. This is not good.
Speaker 2:Like, is not normal. You know? Like, so many times.
Speaker 3:And now he's the COO.
Speaker 2:Yeah. He's still sick.
Speaker 1:How'd you drink?
Speaker 2:I had to beg him to get involved. He did not want to. But he's he's great. And he's know, but there was it was hard because we there was a lot of people telling us, like, I don't know. You know?
Speaker 2:Like, I don't know. Not not a lot of people support you when you're in that weird space. Right? You're like, your mom's like, okay. Like, good luck.
Speaker 2:You know? And you just feel very alone and kinda have to, like you were saying, Harry, like, gotta got you know, like, just believe in magic. And I talked to my sister a lot. It's funny. I always tell this story that I was it was, like, a really, really tough time, and I was like, I need something.
Speaker 2:Like, I need to hear something. I need to, like, read something. I am, like, losing the faith. Like, I don't know what I'm doing. And just like five minutes later, I forget even who sent me the text, but it was someone telling me to listen to the podcast How I Built This.
Speaker 3:So good.
Speaker 2:I listened to that podcast, like, nonstop. I, like, binged it for two weeks and it brought me back to life. I was like, holy crap. There's other people. Like, all of these stories, like, of people not being able to pay payroll or like, you know, the Stonyfield Farm yogurt guys, they got like that product locked in.
Speaker 2:I mean, it was just like, that was exactly what I needed, you know. Yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's like that show because we've been thinking about this a lot because we're in the process of trying to break through that wall. And you have the best days of your life as an entrepreneur, then the next day is really the worst day of your life. You feel by you feel literally bipolar, mentally insane.
Speaker 2:I know. Don't accelerate. Don't continue. I know.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Because you just don't know what the next day is gonna be like. Harry and I have been saying, maybe it's actually supposed to be hard, and the fact that it's hard is a good thing. Like like, no shit. You're selling a raw dog food company that's way more expensive.
Speaker 3:Obviously, it's gonna be hard to scale that or, like, a protein powder, like, turning a podcast into a business. Do you know how hard that is to do?
Speaker 2:I know. It's crazy. And, like, so many other people wanna do it, and then there's like people that are envious of, especially with probably what you guys are doing because like I've I feel like I I talked to there's like a group in Charleston where I live. It's a bunch of female entrepreneurs and they asked me to speak. And I was like, anyone that's telling you that what they're doing, if they have business and they're starting and it's not hard, they're not doing it right.
Speaker 1:Like Yeah.
Speaker 2:They're not doing it right. Yeah. I mean, it is supposed to be hard. Like, that is part of it. Not hard in a bad way constantly, but sometimes, like, I don't know.
Speaker 2:It feels like, you know, it's you're you're trying to sort of like disrupt a space too. I mean, we're definitely disrupting a space. Right? Oh my gosh. Yeah.
Speaker 2:There's people questioning you. There's like I mean, there's land mines everywhere. And like especially the raw food industry, you know? It's like So I think that if you believe in it and like, you do have to sort of hold on to those small wins though because it carries you through and it gives you the energy to like Yeah. And like eventually, you know, you sort of like it's almost like eating healthy.
Speaker 2:Like, after a few months, you're like, oh, I'm starting okay. Wait, man. We're onto something here. Like, you start to get some traction and momentum. And I think that that's I mean, that's what happened with us.
Speaker 2:We, you know, we needed funding and we were looking and it was tough and we were like, kept pulling rabbits out of our hats. We were like, oh, we got money over here, money over here. And then and then we eventually partnered with some really good investors and it was the best thing. And, you know, we wouldn't have gotten there though if it wasn't a lot of my crazy, like, just like I I felt like there wasn't really a choice. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:You know? Like, I felt like I think if I felt like maybe I'm giving myself, like, too much credit saying, like, I pushed through the hard. I I don't feel like and I did push through the hard, but I also felt like I didn't have a choice. So I had to push through the hard. But again, it was really cool to push through the hard because it's not like you're like, oh, on the other side.
Speaker 2:There's still like tons of more work
Speaker 3:all Yeah. The time every
Speaker 2:And then here's four hards. Yeah. Congratulations. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I like It's the like best feeling when you feel like there's no choice.
Speaker 3:Like
Speaker 1:Yeah. This is just it. You're like in harmony with what you're supposed to do.
Speaker 3:There's a freedom.
Speaker 2:Yeah. There's a freedom.
Speaker 3:There's no plan b. No. It's either you're gonna make this or you're
Speaker 2:gonna be on
Speaker 3:the streets.
Speaker 2:And like, what's the j z code? Like, I love, it's like the genius thing we did was that we didn't give up, which is, like, so simple, but it's like, it's that is genius. Right? It doesn't have to be like, oh, some, like, smart professor giving you this, like, really profound quote. It's like, that's what's genius about it.
Speaker 2:So many people do give up. Right? So many people do.
Speaker 3:Yeah. When you accept that you're not gonna give up, you basically take away the time horizon where it's like, if you keep shooting bullets, eventually, you will be successful. Yeah. It might not be in a year. It might be twenty years, but eventually, you're going to get there.
Speaker 2:Right. And you might have to pivot and you have to be nimble and you have to, like, can't get to sometimes it like opens up different doors and you have to like try different things. But, yeah, I mean, I do think there's just a lot to be said for not giving up.
Speaker 3:I love what you were saying about celebrating the small wins too. And I've been thinking about this a lot that more entrepreneurs or people that are doing something or creating something should really take inventory at the end of their week on all the things that they did. Because sometimes it's like, we'll be at the end of our week and be like, shit, we have to do all this other stuff. We could have done this, we could have done that. Yeah.
Speaker 3:And like last I think it was on like Friday or Saturday, we were like, we were like, dude, we did this and did that. Like, that's actually an amazing week. Like, why are we not recognizing how great that was? Like, if you knew that you were gonna do what you just did a year ago I know. You would have been so proud of yourself.
Speaker 2:It's it's true. Have the same problem. I can't help you.
Speaker 3:I feel
Speaker 1:like it's sometimes
Speaker 3:I can't help you.
Speaker 1:Sometimes the wins happen like a lightning bolt. It's like Yes. Oh, you had a phone call with someone Yeah. And it was just like, you know, something big happened, but then the losses feel like they're just persist, you know? Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like the balance isn't equal, but
Speaker 2:it's it's every day. There's failures and wins every day. Like, you just have to roll with them and, you know, I think the the most important lesson I've learned is just to not get too bogged down with them. Like, you just have to be able to be resilient and bounce back faster. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:I felt that for sure that change in me and I was like, okay. Alright. Now I'm feeling like the growth. Like, I'm not I used to be like, oh my god. What are we gonna do?
Speaker 2:Like, this is you know, and now my you know, there it's also like you build confidence because you're like, you've been through worse before, you know. My husband and I always say that, like, there's been worse before. Definitely.
Speaker 1:Yeah. What's been your guys' biggest win?
Speaker 2:Oh, gosh. I mean, I think trying to think like what how to choose. I think probably when we part we partnered with these investors Mhmm. They are big raw champions and they were, you know, we were having long calls with lots of VCs and it wasn't the best discussions all the time. And people that just maybe don't really get it or don't get the vision or just, you know, looking for money.
Speaker 2:These these people are, again, Raw champions and they believe in Raw, you know. So that felt like we went through, you know, a lot of negotiations with them and ended up signing a deal where, you know, they are big investors and it's worked out really well for us. And it's it's been good because it's given us, you know, solid footing kind of. Like, we're not just like every month like, my you know, it's hard. Raw raw raw frozen food.
Speaker 2:I mean, you're shipping raw frozen meat around the country. Like, there's so many things that can happen. So not that those things still can happen, but like we've been like shored up. And now we have we used to only have like we used to ship when we had a facility in Maine. So like at the Northeast, like the corner of the country to the rest, you can imagine how expensive that was, all the problems that can happen.
Speaker 2:Now we have three distribution centers. We we manufacture our food in the center of the the country. And then we have distribution centers in California, New Jersey, and Dallas, Texas. Mhmm. So everything's like fast shipping.
Speaker 2:We have much you know, everything usually gets there within one or two days at the most. Chips frozen, it shows up frozen. So we're just in a better place. But like with growth comes like other problems too. Definitely.
Speaker 2:More things and more exposure and people saying things and like competition. I mean, it's just so but it's it's, dare I say, fun to, you know, to be it's fun learning. Mhmm. Mhmm. Some days I'm like, I don't think it's fun.
Speaker 2:But I think overall, like looking at it, it's fun. It's rewarding. It's it's you know, sometimes if you're just in a like a nine to five job, like, I could never go back to a nine to Could you
Speaker 3:guys? No.
Speaker 2:It's like stagnation hell.
Speaker 3:I don't talk about
Speaker 1:that all
Speaker 2:the time. So I don't know. That's that's something. Right? You know?
Speaker 2:Making a difference. Also, we are doing something good. Like, that is so cool. Right? I mean, not to say anything bad about Kenneth Cole because they're a great company to work for, but like write writing fashion copy isn't really doing that much for humanity.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, not that we're doing something, but we are helping dogs. Like, have an
Speaker 1:amazing What's that? Yeah.
Speaker 2:We didn't pay it for it. But we're helping so many dogs, and it's such a good product, and it feels really good. I and also, like, everyone that works at our company believes in it so much.
Speaker 1:It's so
Speaker 2:fun to be around all of these people that believe in the product so much. They're all animal lovers. I mean, I don't know if I would hire someone that wasn't an animal lover, but Yeah. They're also just mag you know, we they're magnets to us. So, like, we find these people that are you know, all have like tons of dogs themselves.
Speaker 2:They're like really into dogs. They've come from other dog companies. So it's kind of like I'm always with my my people.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:You know?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Finding the right investors is such a blessing too because I'm sure in some ways, it probably gave you a little bit of a chance to breathe where you're like, alright, we know we're gonna keep the lights on, we can fulfill payroll, we can make investments in other areas to grow the business. Like, have two businesses right now, the media business and the Noble. Noble is, like, is actually funded through angel investors and the media business is purely bootstrapped. And there's definitely pros and cons to both, it's like media business, we don't answer to anyone, but you definitely have those months where you're like, cash flow is getting a little bit tight this month, we got four people to pay Yeah.
Speaker 3:Versus like answer, you know, Noble having being investor funded, it's like, alright. Yeah. You know, we're gonna keep the lights on, we have like a great run rate, you know, we have ability to invest this money, but pros and cons to both for sure.
Speaker 2:For sure. And like, for me, this was never gonna be like,
Speaker 3:oh,
Speaker 2:get rich off of this company. This was really to keep and the company is very successful and it will go on to be very successful. But it's my sister, like, you know, she if she saw it today, I know and I know she sees it. But, like, I know she would be so proud of it. You know?
Speaker 2:It's amazing how many more dogs we're feeding and, like, how many dogs are getting to, like we're saving, you know, because of this. So that's really the most rewarding part.
Speaker 3:Do you know how many dogs you've fed in total?
Speaker 2:I don't know. People have asked me. We don't have such a
Speaker 3:cool statistic. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I know. I guess we could how we how many we fed, how many we currently have. I mean, we have some of these numbers, but, like, we're we're growing a lot though. We're we're like in a very high growth phase, which is a great sign because more and more people are coming, you know Mhmm. Turning to this way of feeding.
Speaker 2:So, yeah.
Speaker 1:What's your guys vision for the next few years?
Speaker 2:So I think we're definitely we'll probably try to open another distribution center too. And we have treats coming.
Speaker 3:We're very
Speaker 2:excited about treats and toppers. So treats will be like single ingredient, really awesome treats of we haven't finalized this yet, but of proteins that we don't offer in meal plans yet. So we have chicken, duck, turkey, beef, venison, and lamb in our meal plan. So there'll be something different than that. And then we're going to do some toppers that are freeze dried.
Speaker 2:So this could be something that you add to our food or to even if you're feeding kibble, so you could, like, feed this freeze dried raw too or for our customers. One of the problems with frozen raw is like, I think it's the best. Freeze dried raw is a great option. Yeah. It's still raw.
Speaker 2:It still has like a lot of the nutrients. It's just you have to add the moisture to it. But for people that are traveling, I mean, it's hard to travel with frozen raw. You know, Harry. Like Terrible.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, we have people that like take their YETI coolers or like
Speaker 3:Yeah. Deep streams.
Speaker 2:All of that. Yeah. But yeah. So having a more like travel friendly option or shelf stable option that's not kibble, but like freeze dried raw. So just expanding line extensions, I think, would be good.
Speaker 2:Also getting much more into, like, a charity part of it too. Mhmm. It's hard with frozen raw because, you know, kibble companies can send, like, bags of food. So they can't just be, like, sending frozen raw to shelters or, you know. So figuring out how we can give back is is important to us too.
Speaker 3:Well, the treats will probably be a great
Speaker 2:way to give back. Because they can be used as hoppers too. And again, they'll be, like, really healthy. So that would be yeah. That's great.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Amy, what's the best way to connect with you or We Feed Raw for people that are interested just to learn more and maybe get some of your dog food?
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, follow us on social. Just at We Feed Raw. I'm always on there. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's where I am always like monitoring that. That's like a very Instagram is our main channel. Mhmm. So we're very engaged with our followers and always answering comments and I'm always seeing all of those. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Probably should not be checking in as much. I think it's important to have your finger on the pulse. Really do. Like I'm so protective of a, it's important to hear what people are saying and getting the feedback. But, you know, just, you know, being in the mix is important.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And social media makes it so much easier to do that.
Speaker 2:Totally. Yeah.
Speaker 1:But thank you so much for joining us. This was so much fun and such so long overdue too.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:So we just appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Thanks, guys.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Have an important role. It's like, nourish Sunny, obviously, which is amazing. You're doing such great work. But even just to, like, learn more about, like, just the humble origins and your sister and how proud you're all probably making her is so amazing.
Speaker 3:For you to be in Austin too, which is ground zero for for that is so special. So
Speaker 2:So special.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much for making Thank the
Speaker 1:you. And seeing me. Cool.
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