#82: Alexander Cortes (@AJA_Cortes) - Embodying Your Heroes Journey

Welcome back to another episode of the Meet Mafia podcast. On today's episode, we are joined by Alexander Cortez. Alexander is an online health coach with decades of knowledge on performance in the gym. In our conversation with Alexander, we talked about traveling as a tool for growth, finding archetypes and role models, maintaining high standards for yourself and others, and challenging yourself in the gym and through combat sports. Alexander spent the year of 2020 practicing Muay Thai in Thailand, and he came back to The United States with a new perspective on what it means to build a healthy body.

His background provides a unique lens into the world of health and wellness, but he also frequently writes about life more generally, specifically about masculinity, building confidence, and living a fulfilling life. Alexander is an incredibly philosophical guy, and we touched on a lot of different topics here, so sit back and enjoy. This episode of the podcast is brought to you by equip foods. Equip provides a complete source of grass fed beef protein with no added chemicals, fillers, binding agents, or artificial coloring or sweeteners. If you're familiar with the supplement industry, you know that most supplements are loaded with ingredients that you can't even pronounce.

Equipped's unflavored prime has one single ingredient derived directly from grass fed beef protein. For purists like ourselves who try to only consume balanced real sources of nutrition, this protein powder checks all the boxes. Go check them out in the link below and use our promo code in the description to get a discount. We get questions all the time about how to incorporate beef liver into a healthy balanced diet. The questions are usually around how to source high quality beef liver, how to overcome the taste of liver, and how to travel and still be able to include beef liver into your diet.

That's why we love Optimal Carnivore, which provides beef liver supplements as well as an organ complex for people to incorporate beef liver without the taste and with the convenience of just being able to pack it into a bag and toss it in your mouth when you're ready for your supplements. Beef liver is an important part of my diet because it provides me with the b twelve, copper, vitamin a that you can't really get from any other food groups. Beef over is truly nature's vitamin, and being able to incorporate it in such an easy form such as this supplement makes it that much better. Go check out optimal carnivore and let us know what you think. Alexander, welcome to the Meat Mafia podcast.

Pleasure to have you here. We're excited for this conversation. We know you're gonna bring a lot to the table, so, excited to dive in here. Looking forward to it.

My first question is, how do we get a doctorate in broscience like you have?

Alright. So there there's a little bit of a story

to this.

Yeah. That's the doctorate in broscience from Shatistan. So, you know, for anyone who's on Twitter a lot, you become very familiar with certain Twitter tropes. And what I like there's a recurrent theme on Twitter that for people who are blue checks and they have a PhD of some kind, And they'll want to remind their following an audience about that. I I am a doctor of education, and you need to respect me, essentially.

Like, I have a superior opinion. So the doctor of broscience was just my play on that, which I mean, if I was being honest, do I think I deserve a doctorate after twelve years of training clients? I think so. Like, there's a level of of applied knowledge I have that I think is pretty incomparable.

But, yeah, also, it's

just it's a yeah. It's a pun, essentially. It's a meme. Yeah. And then also to the fitness industry, there's this deference given to science and evidence.

Mhmm. Base training or what people think of science and evidence. Yeah. If you really dig into science as a field or like, yes, the whole field of science, whether it be fitness, whether it be nutrition, whether it be sports science, exercise science, you know, health, biology, social sciences, the replication crisis, like, spans the entire it it spans the entire paradigm. Yeah.

Bad bad studies, bad research, falsified research, compromised research, private interest groups, special interests, lobbyists, you know, like so, you know, science trademark is, you know, kinda compromised. So then, you know, taking science as arbiter of truth in thinking that you need to listen to people who supposedly are scientists, PhD, now you fucking know.

Yeah.

A a lot of a lot a lot a lot of people in a lot a lot a lot of fields are completely bullshit. You know, it's like, you know, very recently, there was that there was that news headline, which I kinda dug into because I was really fascinated by it. Then, apparently, the whole basically, that last decade of Alzheimer's research and the supposed, like, top protein breakdown, like, what causes Alzheimer's Hilarious research was based upon falsified data Wow. By two scientists. I I forget the names.

But, you know, I mean, to the you know, so, like, on a broad level okay. So we we had a whole decade where billions of dollar was spent. Tons of speculation conjecture was made. You know, probably 10 tens of thousand hundreds of thousands of recommendations were given out, whether it'd be to patients or whether it'd be to research departments of, like, this is what we need to study, what we need to focus on. At the end of the decade, we find out, oh, this was all based on bullshit that two people made up for money.

Yeah. It's it's funny because you come onto the world of Twitter too, and there is there's a little bit of, like, this playful banter around people who are always in need of, like, the study to support every single piece of data or or new, new, ideas around performance, nutrition, health, even beyond that. And all these fields are generally soft sciences. So it's like, when you look into the past and see what's worked in the past, generally, that, you know, that's kind of the best, best road map for building building out any sort of plan around health and nutrition. And then, you know, there's a lot of these, like, new studies being done on things that kind of, like, force people to, you know, think that they know potentially more than other people.

It's it's, it's an interesting, interesting sphere to be in.

Yeah. I mean, nutrition I mean, nutrition's like a lot of other fields. I mean, I'm not the first person to bring up, like, you know, the low fat craze or, you know, low low fat craze, low carb craze, you know, the ant like, the sort of the the very we had a few decades now kind of, like, anti red meat, anti eggs, anti saturated fats. Is red meat bad for you? Now I could tell, obviously, the the social shift now is gonna be demonizing animal protein Yes.

Which is bug protein, essentially. But, like, you you see this stuff happening. It's like world studies. Studies don't mean anything in isolation.

You know?

Like, good if if you're gonna do if you're going to be an honest scientist and practice good science, you are gonna make observations. Like, this is sort of like the classic sort of like Aristotle model science. Like, you make observations of just what you see, and you can derive a lot of truth just from observation. You can establish cause and effect. Then you create theories where it's like, okay.

Like, I'm I'm seeing things happen. I'm I'm seeing a equals b. I'm seeing the same patterns happen over and over. Let me try and figure out what the mechanism might be. And then you test those things.

You find a way to test it. And then if you can test it enough times repeatedly over and over and over again, you keep getting the same outcomes, maybe you're getting closer to truth. It doesn't mean you found what is exactly true, but you've gotten closer to recognizing some, you know, first principle kind of relationship. That's good science. A single study that's done that's paid for by Bitcoin, you know, that then gets submitted to NBC for publication.

Like, that that is this that is this peak I don't know what you call it. It's peak nepotism. Yes. You know, then to to to default to that, I was like, well, it's science. Like, that that's not science.

That's that's people paying for their personal agenda. You know? Like, god god no. Like, there's a whole book written of how to lie statistics. You know?

To to be able to lie with numbers is is, of in itself, a skill. Yeah. Yeah. And most people are numerically literate. You know?

I you can very easily this is done all the time in exercise science. You look at there'll be a study. It's like, oh, this was a I'll I'll sort of just, you know, get some basic. Like, a study was done, and it showed that this exercise leads to 25% more muscle growth. Like, oh, shit.

Wow. That's a lot. Damn. And then you look at you you go in and, like, you look at the study. And, you know, the the p values they used and the way they plot out the data and the actual muscle growth and, you know, the the relative difference versus the absolute difference was this exercise built, you know, basically two grams more muscle than the other exercise.

There's actually almost no there's no well, there was no meaningful meaningful statistical difference in outcome. But we measured it so many different ways that we finally got the result we want, and now it's 25%. And that gets sent all the time. And those studies never get replicated again.

Yes.

You know, like, that's that's a that's a common common problem issue, like, again, replication crisis, where half of all research that's done is basically unreplicable or just crap research. This it's just, you know, bad experiments get set up. You know? But a bad experiment with a, I guess, you could say, like, a, like, a mimetic kind of outcome that people like and it sounds good. Like, it can just it can spread.

You know, psychology is notorious for this. It's like supposedly psychological truths, realities of, you know, human behavior. Then the data gets dug into it. It's like, oh, it's never got replicated. Never been replicated since.

But now we now we believe this about well, this is how people behave.

Yes. And you touched on the animal protein versus bug protein. And Harrison and I touch on this all the time. You particularly see that in the demonization of red meat of these these organizations and scientists. They're very strategic.

They know exactly how to manipulate the percentages in a way that goes that makes you go, holy shit. This actually isn't good for me to be eating. And that's why I think you make a great point too of, like, regardless of what side you're on, don't just accept the statistic as face value. Like, take it another step further and do your own research to figure out what that percentage actually means.

Yeah. I'm a %. And then, like, this is where you have to like, I I give a lot more weight to anecdotal historical data than, I guess, you say, or, like, experimental, like, you know, study data. If you have if if human beings if nature has been doing us the same recurrent pattern of behavior for essentially millennia, You know, it's a meat, for example. That's a very easy one.

Like, okay. Like, how long are people eating meat? Yeah. We can reasonably estimate, like, a couple hundred thousand years, like, at least. Yeah.

Like, there's no, you know, there's no stop point of how back that historic how far back that historic worker goes. Okay. So this thing that we ate since, let's just say, you know, 500,000 BC, it suddenly became really bad for us, like, in 1975, '80. That that doesn't make sense. Yeah.

It it doesn't make sense. Like, there's that there's a big break in logic there. Yeah. Like, it's, you know, let's like, when I was in India, for example, I've been to India. Like, I've lived there for a period of time.

Like, I've traveled there. You know, this I mean, this is more observational. Like, this is scientific. Well, it's observational. You go so you go to a country where a lot of people are vegetarian.

You see, okay. People are vegetarian, a lot of diabetes, insulin resistance, a lot of malnutrition, a lot of diseases of famine, essentially, from lack of certain nutrients. People don't eat meat here. You go to another country, you know, like, you know, Hong Kong, I think, is the example for this. Hong Kong is, like, the highest red meat consumption of a country on Earth.

Its average lifespan is, like, eighty six years. Mhmm. Yeah. India is, like, sixty eight. Now this is corollary.

Right? But I can go to one country, they eat a lot of red meat, less obesity. I go to another country, they eat far less meat, very low protein diet, a lot more obesity, a lot of impoverished diseases, lower lifespan. You know, if I weigh if I weigh those two things together, it's like, what do you think is a superior diet for human health? Like, I I don't think it's the low protein diet.

I think it's a higher protein diet.

Right. That's that's not a you know,

that that's a I mean, you can call you can call that a biased observation. Like, I don't think that's an unformed observation. You know, if it's like you have people in this country. They're dead at 68, insulin resistant. This country, they're dead at 86, no insulin resistance.

Mhmm.

Did the diet play a role in their health? Like, obviously, it does. Yeah. You know, like, this again, this is basic observation. Like, you you know, you could argue otherwise and, like, you're just kinda being senseless at that point.

Yeah. It it seems like there's a lot of camps out there too now who are trying to just, like, convince people of all these, like, new new, new ideas around nutrition, which, you know, is, is a bit frightening. But, one of the things I was interested in talking to you about, I I heard a bunch about your COVID story and how you kinda, made 2021 of the best years of your life through Oh. Travel and and things like that. I I I think that'd be a great starting point just learning more about you and sort of how you think about the things and how do you how you think about things and how you view the world.

We know you're big into health and nutrition, but, it sounded like you had a pretty cool 2020. Twenty '20 was great.

Yeah. So I mean, let me give you some context to this. So I've so I I've been a personal trainer since 02/2010, and I I I've always been very observational of the world at large. And I saw around, like, probably around 02/2012, '2 thousand '13 that the fitness industry was exploding due to Instagram, due to this the online world, and this digital economy was arising. And today, like, we call this having a personal brand influencer Wi Fi money.

Nobody called it back 02/2012. You know, the idea of making money online in 02/2012 was this is it was completely novel. Like, nobody knew what they even meant. It was just, like, four hour workweek count idea of, like, what? Like, how Right.

How does

anyone get paid online? Like, who's gonna pay for your shit? Right? But I saw how this online economy was growing and people, you know, at least in the fitness industry, they were making money from having a following, from having information products. YouTube was steadily growing, and there was this knowledge economy that was, you know, grid getting bigger by the day.

I'm like, okay. Like, there's a way to capitalize on this. Mhmm. You know, fitness, you know, took the cost of job being a personal trainer, that's an hourly job. But if you use the tools you have online, you can scale your knowledge.

So I knew at some point in the future, I'm like, I need to get to a point. I need to get to a level of having enough knowledge, applied knowledge, practical knowledge, book knowledge, built my skill sets in regards to sales, marketing, knowing how to navigate through the online culture where I can start an online business. I can create a following around myself. And I finally went all in on that in 02/2017, and it it worked. Yeah.

I started posting on Twitter a lot, started getting a following, started hitting my email list growing substantially. And in 02/2018, I kinda had that breakthrough moment where things took off. You know, started making money where it went from being a couple hundred dollars a month. Like, oh, cool. Now I'm making, you know, $5.06, $7.08, $10,000 a month.

Like, oh, shit. Like, this is working. Awesome. At the same time this is happening, Trump is president. The US is becoming hyperpolarized.

And I didn't know COVID was gonna happen, but it was very obvious that, like, we're we're heading we're reaching we're we're reaching ever greater levels of fractionation. Like, every day, there's a new fraction point in culture. There's new cultural divisions. Like, the yeah. And this, again, it's cliche to say the country is coming apart socially.

Mhmm. And, like, we've seen this now, like, with the you know, I could reference, like, the decision, you know, the Roe versus Wade being reversed. It's like now states having more power. Yes. Decentralization, this constant b decentralization is really taking hold across all these different social spheres.

So this is happening. I'm like, I grew up in California. I'm not gonna go on my California ramps, but, like, I was I was fed up with California. Like, you know, I don't wanna live in California anymore. This is now 02/2019.

Like, I wanna actually live abroad. So I decided I'm gonna travel abroad for a year, maybe longer, and see how it goes. As it happened, this is now late two thousand nineteen. COVID is in the background in China. And then when COVID finally took effect globally, I was with my girlfriend, now wife, in Egypt.

Lockdowns start happening. This is in March. And we're trying to figure out, like, do we go back to United States? Do we like, where do we go? Airports were closing.

Everything the situation was changing by the minute, and we were able to get into Thailand. So I ended up being in Thailand basically the entire year 02/2020 from March until December, which was amazing. It was awesome. So it it gave me time to focus my business far more on, like, the home home training, home gym market. I expanded my product line significantly.

I lost I lost a membership group. Like, business basically doubled in 02/2020. Because everybody was at home, nobody was working, and people will still spend money.

Yes.

Everybody was spending money on everything online. It was fucking amazing. I'll never I'm probably I'll never have another year like that again. It was a it's perfect storm of everything that could go right for an online business. And at the same time, I started training Muay Thai, working with, a very famous champion in the golden age Muay Thai named Sagat.

So I I was working with him for six months, got into training Muay Thai regularly. That particular has become my thing. So 02/2020, it was it was a great year of personal growth. We've gone to fantastic shape, a little bit of fight. Business took off.

Made the most amount of money I ever made. It it was an awesome year. Yeah. And then it was finally it was funny when I finally came back to The United States since I was at a point. I'm like, okay.

I need to change my tax situation, establish tax base in different states, you know, completely separate myself from California. And And so I got I get back 02/2021, and everybody's in a bad mood Yeah. Basically. And the whole US is, like, it was the summer of of, Black Lives Matters, George Floyd, all the peaceful protests, all the cities being burnt down. You know, that's we could go on that for a while.

But, so, yeah, cities being burnt down, crimes exploding, massive increase in murders, larceny, theft, looting, all this stuff, you know, race race wars. I'm like, when I get back from Thailand, I'm like, wow, man. You guys everyone's in a really bad fucking mood here. Yeah. So it was interesting.

I'm like, clearly, we've had different experiences. And then, of course, on Twitter, you see every you see this constant, you know, daily refrain of, like, my mental health is my mental health is declining, You know, depression skyrocketing, supposedly alcoholism, drug use, kids are being left behind. And, like and I feel bad. Like, I feel bad about this. Right?

And, like, I'm laughing. I'm like, shit. Like, this is clearly a difficult time for most people. Yep. Personally, though, the best fucking time I've ever had.

Yeah. It was just it was great. It was great. And it allowed me to set my life now where I can do whatever the fuck I want in an even day Mhmm. And have total freedom.

Do you Thank you, China.

Thank you, China. Number one. Do you do you think that after so after that Thailand experience, do you think it's important for all men to experience, like, a an environmental shift of just getting out of wherever you've been and forcing yourself to go somewhere new and allow the change to be embraced from everything that comes from that?

I would say yes. This is what travel can do for you. I'm not gonna say it will, but this is what it can do, I think, if if you travel with the right mindset. We all grew up in a place. And, you know, for most people, unless your parents travel a lot, you constantly change environments, you're probably gonna grow up in one or two places for most of your life, most of your childhood, at least.

So your paradigm of reality, what you think about the world, the people that you know, it's shaped by that place. And you you don't know that many people. You grew up in a town even if you grew up in a large city. You only know where you live. You go somewhere else where it's a different his different social history, different cultural history, this different history period.

If it's a different civilization, if you go from east to west or from west to east, two completely different civilizations of cultures. They don't are not really compatible with each other. Yeah. I I've said this, you know, common thread before, but, like, you know, Indian civilization, you know, Southeast Asian civilizations, it's hard to compare them to Western world because they're really not connected with each other up until very recently. They developed not in isolation, but they developed this geographically separate for many thousands of years.

But you so you go somewhere else. You go to a different civilization. And what you know, what you think about the world, it gets tested by your new environment. So it gives you a different perspective on human relationships, on truth, on your, you know, your own personal beliefs, on, you know, the connections that you have with your home, if you have any, with your family, with your culture, with your native language versus the new language. You know, are are all cultures equal?

That's its own discussion. Maybe they're not. If you travel around enough different places, life is certainly better in some places versus others. Yeah. Yeah.

Some some cultures have some advantages. Some have disadvantages. Okay. So it gives you perspective on the human condition. Yeah.

And then from those experiences, you develop a better sense of who you are and what you believe in, how you live your life. And then, you know, if you decide to be settled in a place, whatever plans you make, I would say you're going to make a much more inform you're going to make a much more informed decision based upon this, you know, a broader set of, you know, lived experiences, perspectives, knowledge. And, also, it's it's cool to travel. Just for the sheer novelty of it. Like, you can see the world and the worlds of people place, and there's all different kinds of people.

Have there been any travel experiences particularly for you that have kinda shaped your or shifted your perspective in a way that has been more powerful than others?

I I would say this, like, this is, like, a California specific, to The United States. So, like, for people that grew up in California, Californians are very arrogant, like, unknowingly, where, like, there's this assumption that California is, like, the most progressive state, the best state, the the greatest place in America. States, and you realize, like, it's not. California is certain California is certainly geographically beautiful, the environment. Yeah.

The natural beauty is amazing. Mhmm. But California as a state, as a bureaucracy, you have the government, different services, you know, just, you know, the freeway system. A lot of things in California really don't run well. So what was interesting to me when I was much younger, like, this is, like, my late teens, early twenties, and I kinda traveled around The United States a bit.

And I saw other states, and I realized, like, oh, California is kind of overrated. Mhmm. Like, this you know, this state next door is just as nice as California, and the roads off the freeway is better. You go you know, like, I mean, I could there's lots like, you don't this is again, like I said, very specific. You grow up in California and you go to the South.

Anywhere like, any just pick a southern state. Go to Texas. Go to Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi, Missouri, Florida, you know, Tennessee. You're like, oh, people here are really nice and really friendly, and there's you know, like, the the assumption that Californians have of, like, every other state except them is, like, rednecks with the with KKK running around hanging black people. You're like, maybe I just believe a lot of stupid shit in California.

And then, you know, so there's that factor. You also see and I've seen this last twenty years as California has precipitously fucking decline in a lot of ways that who you vote for does in fact matter. It will eventually matter. Yeah.

The

people that run their your fucking government, their their decision making is going to, at some point, affect you and your quality of life and your mobility, and, you know, you're gonna have to make decisions, you know, based off of their decisions. You know, so that was kinda like there there was no one moment that was eye opening, but it it from growing up in California my whole life and then traveling, it definitely broke my favoritism of, like, this is the greatest place on Earth. It it's not. It's one state of 50. It certainly has cultural capital.

It's a big economy. Like, no question about that. But life is good in a lot of other places. Mhmm. And you also see too as you travel abroad and you go to different cities internationally, US cities kinda just fucking suck.

European cities as a whole, just pick a fucking country. Go to any old city in any European country, whether it be France, England, Germany, Spain, whatever. Way fucking nicer, way easier to walk around. Architecture is beautiful. You're like, wow.

This is this is amazing. Yeah. Go to you know, for me, like, go to my fucking suburban hometown. And you're like, you just like, you can't compare the two. It's just like it's it's it's, it's like a car paradise.

Straight suburbia. You go to Los Angeles. You gotta be in your car, right, driving around. Homeless population and crime are ridiculous. You go to I can go to country I can go to Eastern Europe and go to Slovenia.

I can go to Budapest, Bucharest. I I go to basically any major city in Eastern Europe, and it's nicer and safer and better rent and less crime and more pleasant to walk around. And then you go back again, you go back to US cities. You're like, this is kinda fucking third world. Like, American cities are just you know, especially large cities are kinda shitty.

Yeah. They're not that great. Miami's, you know, come Miami compared to Mexico City, fucking overrated. Compared to a lot of cities in South America, fucking overrated. You know?

But, like, for The US, it's kinda cool.

Yeah. The

Col it's less culture there. But, like, The US as a whole, like, I would say it this way. The United States is the absolute best country in the world for making money, barn hunt. We we are fucking capitalism on steroids. If you wanna get fucking rich, come to The United States.

Do business here. Get paid in the USD. It's gonna be the the currency of the world for a long time. In regards to quality and and livability of culture itself, city life, it's subpar. Mhmm.

And I think a lot of people came away to that through COVID of just realizing, like, I think I'm the perfect example of being in New York for three years. Harrison was up in Boston for a few years. You're in these Northeast cities. And when you're in the moment and you're working this corporate job, you think it's great. You know, you get captivated by the energy

Right.

What everyone else is doing, and then you're you're you're pulled away from that, and you're like, well, why the fuck am I actually here? Why don't I go somewhere else? And I think that there are a ton of people that have had a similar awakening to what you're talking about and are way happier because of it.

Yeah. No. I mean, I I have no doubt. Like, the the exodus from various blue cities and blue states the last year and a half to red states or even people moving overseas, like, it's been substantial. Yeah.

Yeah. And then, you know, these people realize as they got especially with the lockdowns and, you know, if you were again, depending upon where you live, what state you were and city you were in, you might have had a friendly local government sheriff's department that didn't reinforce anything, was much looser, people were less paranoid, or you might have been somewhere where lockdowns were ridiculously long and people were getting arrested on the street. And, you know, for the first time, you have to, again, like, question, like, who who are my leaders? Who who's making these decisions? These these are human beings that were deciding this.

And then do I wanna stay living here?

No. I'm gonna leave. Okay.

Where am I where am I gonna move to?

Yeah. The idea of remote remote work, I think, actually helped a lot of people actually spend time in other places too because I think the American mentality around travel is typically just to, like, show up, do the top 10 list, and then get out of there. But you could actually go and spend, like, a month in a place and actually get to enjoy the culture and see what the people are actually really like or, you know, just just settle in a place for a longer period of time remotely. And this is obviously, you know, probably not for this wasn't everyone's experience, but I No. I know several people who who did this type of thing.

And it actually give it gives you a lens into how life could be in a different place, which, you know, I I I think and I hope that a lot more people get to take advantage of that because it's valuable valuable to be able to move around and and get to experience different cultures and and, perspectives of the world.

Oh, hugely. There there the remote work shift, that was really interesting since yeah. It's one of those trends that nobody could have predicted thirty years ago. Like, it like, the Internet is what made that happen. You know, if you had told people that 1990, you're gonna work for like, if you had told anyone in 1990 that you're gonna have the Internet and it's going to enable, you know, 40% of the workforce to learn you work from home, and you'll never have to go to an office ever again.

Like, it would have been an insane idea. Mhmm. Like, nobody will believe that. Yeah. And then now today, like, when you have major companies, FAANG corporations, where they've shifted to work from home.

You know, like, a majority of their employee base works from home. It's like, okay. Like, you don't have to go to an office anymore. You're not geographically tied to a particular location or city. Yeah.

Like so, I mean, it's actually democratized work, I think, because now you can work for a company. You could be anywhere in the world. They could be anywhere in the world. Like, what is that gonna do for salaries when people get paid? I I don't know.

But it's certainly gonna change things. Definitely. The fact that I can live in America and I can hire someone in India, in Argentina, in The Dominican Republic, in, you know, Georgia, in Eastern Europe, and we can all work, you know I mean, not in the same time, so we can all work on the same project and correspond with each other. That that, like, almost breaks the mind to think about that. Like, this is never you've never been capable of this before.

We have never been capable of this before in human history. Mhmm. We can harness human capital from anywhere at any given time. Wow. Like Yep.

Yeah. Like, that that's that's it's insane to think about. You have to again, up until 02/2010, if you're gonna work, you had to you had to go to that place. You had to physically be in that place. There was no other way to do it.

Yeah. The the leverage is is pretty incredible. One of the things that we were interested in, Ajak, was you'd mentioned some of the societal issues that you returned to and just saw you know, you were talking about the George Floyd situation, how unhappy a lot of Americans are. And we know that's something you do a lot of speaking about is just the role of masculinity and strength and maybe where that's gone in society. So do you see a strong correlation between, like, a lack of masculinity and some of the issues that have arisen over the last few years?

Oh, 100%. Yeah. I mean, if I had to it's hard always hard to reduce cultural issues down to a single thing because it's always yeah. It's multifactorial. You know?

But if if I had to point to what I think is one thing that sort of underlies, you know, all of Americans all of America's problems, it's a lack of standards. And lack of standards, I mean, everywhere. Just pick a field, and there's a lack of standards. Whether that be in education and it's because of racial affirmative action, you know, reverse affirmative action, know, discrimination against Asians, discrimination against against whites. Like, okay.

Let's let's let's lower the standards to accommodate, you know, like, a you know, we see it. Let's lower the standard to accommodate more people who would, you know, normally, like, would not meet the standards. Whether that's in the military, whether that's in corporations with the hiring process, whether that's in, like, California, as an example. People can I call it, like, the the urban munch house syndrome, where if you live in a city and that quality of life in that city slowly declines over time, it's very easy to rationalize the decisions that get made on level city governance? Like, oh, a crime's going up, but, you know, it's not that bad.

Okay. Homeless population went up. Well, you know, you know, people have problems. We shouldn't be doing judgmental. You know, things get you know, things take longer to get fixed.

Well, you know, at least they're getting fixed. You know, the cops are slower to respond. Oh, you know, now I'm kinda questioning living here, but, you know, I can afford to have my car broken into. Like, it's not gonna not not gonna kill me. It's not gonna put me on the street.

Okay. You just keep rationalizing every small tyranny that happens until you hit a point in time. You're like, how how the fuck is this why am I living here? Like, what what what am I paying for to live here? You can see that in education.

You know? US education standards slowly just been declining and declining and declining and declining, and there's always a reason given. Yeah. And whether that reason is, you know, based on cultural Marxism or just like a this is really a breakdown in logic and truth, like this removal objectivity. You keep you keep having this continuous lowering of the bar over and over and over again.

Now what does that mean, you know, for being a man? Well, it means being a man doesn't really mean anything. The same way now, like, being a woman doesn't mean being anything. Anyone could be a woman. I can wake up tomorrow and put on a wig, and I'm a woman if I if I feel like it, apparently.

Mhmm. You know, with a with with women with I got women biceps and fucking women hair big hair big I have a big, you know, hairy ball sack. That's a woman ball sack, if I feel like. And you have to accept my truth. You're you're the bigot.

Yes. And they're like, can we laugh out this? Like, that's fucking insanity. Like, there's people actually doing that. Like, they're they're they're they're they're browbeat people with that, and they're claiming sort of, like, a press, you know, press status.

Like, how did we get here? I would say, like, we accepted a lower standard of truth, of performance, skill, of competency. We've made being good at something not mean anything. Mhmm. And now we have lost our entire objections to reality.

Mhmm. And you when you cannot objectively distinguish between what's true and what's false when the definition of definition is getting edited.

Yep.

How do you make sense of the world at large? You know? And how you know, if you're a man individually, how do you know how to act? You know? The the way that we create ourselves is from our cultural social role models.

Right. We need we need to believe in something that tells you, hey. You know what? You need to be strong and competent. Yeah.

What does that mean? You just don't overthink it. Like, you just you need to be strong. You need to be good at shit. You know, super basic.

Right? If I tell you that strength is oppressive and you being good at something might make people who are bad at something feel bad, what are you supposed to do? And I'm I'm being super reductionist right now. But, again, you you you analyze, like I said, alexipenarian society, and you see this breakdown. You know, it doesn't matter what the what the realm is.

And then you wonder, like, why are people going crazy? Like, how could she not go crazy?

Yeah. Yeah. There's no there's no, the dilution of objective truth is something that I think it you hit on that is so spot on. I I was reading one of your articles about archetypes, and I think that that from a personal empowerment standpoint, having an archetype or two are you know, a handful of archetypes that you in your mind create, whether it's through historical perspective, knowing someone in the past and how they were, and then trying to build yourself into those types of characters is a good way about, you know, kinda reversing some of these, these narratives that have been pushed on us. Is that something that you think about and something that you talk to your clients about just in terms of empowering, you know, figures that have done certain things in the past?

Yes. I mean, what you need to be what every what every man needs to do I mean, this is sort of like this is the burden of being a man and the burden of performance is, like, it is on you to save yourself. So if you're a young man today, you need to find those role models. You know, those archetypical role models that you can imitate. You know?

Not that not to copy them and be them, but be similar enough to them. You know? Be akin and characteristic to them that you can be, you know, actually be a man and be functional society and be competent, and you can design and have control over your own life. Yeah. If you don't do that, then you're at the mercy of whatever social force forces and whatever, you know, whatever's trendy.

And it's probably gonna eat you alive. Yeah.

Are there any archetypes that you particularly resonate with or peep historical figures that you kinda model your life after?

Yeah. There's really there's probably only one. So, I mean, like, this and this is very this is very generic. This is anything, you know, special. Yeah.

A lot of young men could tell you this. So, like so when I was growing up so I grew up in nineteen nineties. And this is before cartoons went woke and gay. So the the boy cartoons back then were all superhero cartoons. They you know, there's, you know, there's Batman, Superman, Spider Man, Justice League, Conan the Barbarian, I I remember distinctly.

Yeah. And what is a heroic archetype? A hero is hypercapable. That's what makes someone heroic. You have an elite level of capability that no matter what situation no matter what kind of challenging situation you encounter, you are able to handle it because of a combination of courage and skill and just in general force of personality force of will.

That's been heroic. And I always identify with that. I I never I want to be the kind of person where I could handle anything I like through it. I wanna be that kind of man. You know, what do heroes lack?

Heroes typically don't show weakness because if you show weakness, you lose. Right? Like, that's very basic. Like, you have to be strong of your hero. Fundamental.

Heroes are typically not dependent upon other people. That's I've seen this change now the last twenty years or so where, like, if you watch modern films, cartoons, there's a lot more emphasis put on, like, cooperation and having, like, a, like, having a sort of a supportive network of friends, like, to help you accomplish something versus, like, thirty years ago, it was much more like the lone wolf kinda hero. Like, it's you, maybe your partner or two of your team, and, like, that's it. Right. It's not it's not everybody else.

You know? And this is why the the current this is why the last crop Star Wars movies were so fucking god awful for many reasons. But, like, a hero, it it's a fun understanding that you against the world. You're going to you're going to live you're going to live your life alone. You're gonna die alone, and it's up to you to make the difference.

Mhmm. You can't rely upon anyone but yourself. And that that always resonated with me. Yeah. I still think of, like, my life that way to this day.

Like, I I'm I'm the master and commander of my reality, my universe. I'm the one that determines this direction. No one else. Mhmm. You know, like, I'm I'm not you're you're never gonna see me, you know, complain about, I'm stressed.

I have anxiety. The the fuck is that? You know? I I I I can't remember a single fucking Saturday morning cartoon that any fucking superhero ever said he he felt anxious about shit. Not a fucking thing.

That's not a male emotion. Like, I don't I don't believe in it. Yeah. Anxiety is for women. You know?

Same for stress. Like, you know, my dad I I I don't remember a time in my life ever. My dad's had a pretty eventful life where he ever came home and was like, I'm really stressed and worried. Like, my mental health is is suffering right now. The fuck?

I I just I couldn't he's never said those words. It would never occur to him to even express that in the first place. He doesn't think about his life, the world that way.

Yeah. You

know? Now, you know, so many decades later, it's like everyone's a fucking godless, sensitive, masculine, like, new male up in their feelings. It's it's fucking disgusting. So, yeah, all that said, like, what do I you know, how do I what what do I model my archetypes on? Just be heroic.

Yeah.

Do you

think do you think, the annihilation of ego like, there's a this whole, like, school of thought around, like, reducing the ego. Do you think that's something that people are, like, playing too much into where, you know, ego shouldn't be really viewed as this bad thing? Like, there is a certain amount of self identity and and, building oneself up that actually helps people, you know, become their own hero?

Yes. So this this is the issue with egos as it gets conceptualized in modern twenty first century discourse. If you go look at how Freud Freud's kind of the origin of the idea of ego in the first place. You could you could kinda trace ego back to, like, the ancient Greeks, but let's go let's go with Freud. Freud wrote in German, and how he described personality, he didn't it was not the word ego.

Ego was translation. He described the human he he described human psychology, the human mind, sort of being in three parts. You have, like, the the present I, which is, like, who you are in the present moment of life as in your life. You have the I that is below, which is sort of your underlying, like, more base motivations, and you have an the eye above, which is sort of like a higher self, so to speak, of, like, you have what you aspire to. You have what you actually do on a daily basis, and then you have, like, your darker impulses.

So you you have this this three part structure. That got translated to ego where ego is now sort of this construct. Like, okay. You there's you and there's there's your ego. Yeah.

And if you have a I this is why we found scent like this completely lacking sense. If you have a big ego, that's bad. If you have a small ego, I guess that's good. So we're ascribing, like, sort of we're we're we're giving ego this quantity of size, so to speak, and then saying, like, it's bad because being egoic, it means you're arrogant. Like, you think highly of yourself.

You know? Like, so I mean, this this is why psychology is not a science. You know? So we're using, like, sort of these contradicting descriptors to describe something that is completely theoretical in the first place. And then if you go look at for a differential definition, ego is not anything that you can obliterate these just your present conscious mind, which is the point I'm getting at.

So when he was describing ego as being sort of the eye that is in the present, he's just describing just how you operate on moment to moment basis. There's there's nothing to obliterate. Mhmm. You know? So this idea that you're gonna kill ego, it's like, you can kill self limiting beliefs.

You can have beliefs about yourself that are limiting maybe because you believe you're arrogant. You believe falsely. You're more confident than you are. Or maybe you maybe you are self centered, and you have, you know, the syndrome of being, like, the main character of the universe. Mhmm.

And you don't realize how you the universe should give a shit about you. You know, that that is a that is a real thing. But can you kill your ego where, like, okay. Now I've I'm gone. I've I don't know.

Like, could you somehow do that where you have to have a conscious mind? No. Because you still have to shit and sleep and eat and function, wake up and be alive. The only way that your ego would be dead is if you were literally dead. You know?

And the ego killing, when people describe this experience, oh, I had my ego killed. And, like, I I really asked them. They get like, okay. Like, you okay. You took a bunch of iowaspiry.

You did a bunch of fucking drugs. How did your ego die? And it's always the same shit. They they have a bad trip, and they realize during this trip when they're meeting with dark spirits or their childhood or trauma or they're in some extra dimensional universe, whatever the fuck it is. You know, that's this that's this whole different subject we go into.

So they're having a trip, and they realize, you know what? I've had a lot of moments in my life where I've been a piece of shit, and I have a lot of things that I've thought about myself that really kept me from being happy. And I I'm I'm admitting now as I'm tripping balls that I actually am really unhappy with this and this and this and this, and it's because of what I believe. And I'd like to change that. And, also, like, my mind's literally fucking melting down right now from the DMT.

And they come out of the trip, and it's like, oh, fuck. Like, I actually you to use a metaphor, they, for the first time in their life, looked in a mirror, saw who they really are objectively, and they didn't like it at all. And now they're gonna make what are hopefully positive changes in how the act thinks behave. That's good. That's great.

Is there an ego dead, though? No. Your ego is still functioning. You're still alive. Yeah.

It just changed to what it would have thought about itself. Mhmm. You know, so seeking ego death, it's just it's for a lot of the conversation around that, it it's hippity dippy bullshit.

Yes.

But that's just what I keep it. And I I've I've been in these communities. At one time, I went through, like, a groovy phase in my life when I was much younger, mainly to try to hook up with groovy girls. And I was around these kinds of people. And when you get into these these subcultures, they are completely detached from reality in most cases, especially the guys.

Yeah. And a lot of them are kind of predatory, actually. I mean, I'm there I was I was there to get laid too, so who the fuck am I to say? But it's a it's a certain kind of guy where you really wanna, like, be in that and become, like, the that sort of girl personality. Like, I have no ego, which means I've got a fuckload of drugs, and, you know, I'm just I'm feeling things and just having this experience of life, and I'm basically kinda purposeless.

I'm treating existence as a sort of yeah. I I even know what you'd wanna call it. Like, detached, you know, detached, you know, non motivated experience, which nothing means anything except, like, the last book I just read, and everyone's full of shit. Yeah. And I I don't take those people seriously.

I I don't I don't take the that the whole the whole idea of ego killing, I don't really take seriously anymore. You know, I I would tell anyone now if you are struggling with life and you think doing some drugs and some ceremony are the answer, maybe it is the fucking answer. Maybe it is. And maybe what you're gonna find out, like, a lot of people find out is that you are a piece of shit, and you fucked up a whole bunch of different ways, And you need some chemical assistance to help you realize that, which is fine. That's great.

Good for you. But thumbs up. I'm not gonna tell you no. But, yeah, but don't pretend that you discovered some mystical realm and you think you know things.

The type of guy that you were describing before, the the best term that we've ever you heard used to describe it is he slash him trying to get pussy, which is Yes. It's it's spot on, isn't it?

Yeah. I I I mean, I I had experience years ago, and I'll keep the details light since I I don't talk about people I know personally. But I was in this group, and there's this girl that I was we were basically, like there's a girl I was I was dating. Let's call it that. And I remember, like, we're we're going to this we're traveling the mountains.

And as I try to sort of, like, talk to each individual person, you're like, you you know, what do these people believe about, like, itself? And it was just this hodgepodge medley of new age beliefs of I just just name something they believed in. Egyptian gods and goddesses. So the Celts, you know, Ayurveda, Shintoism, Zen, like, every they anything that's was not made through Christianity, they would sort of accept it. Face value is like, oh oh, wow.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's yeah. It's it's the it's it's the the the universe speaking to you.

And I remember at some point, I was I was on the trip very distinctly, and I told them, yeah, guys, I feel like being a vision from, like, the I just made shit up. I'm like, I mean, I'm getting a vision from, like, the, the Ayurvedic, like, unicorn guides. And, like, they're telling me we should go we should go north. Oh, wow. Oh, yeah.

Wow. You really you really communicating with him? Yeah. I am. I'm I'm just this is straight bullshit.

Yeah. And, like, I just and I did this multiple times throughout the week. I'm like, you can really make anything fucking up. And because none of their beliefs are based on anything objective, they just buy into it. Yeah.

Kinda like liberals. This doesn't have to be based on fucking anything real. If it feels good and it sounds good, fucking roll with it.

Yeah. Yeah. One one of the things you touched on earlier is how you said that you don't feel stress or anxiety. Do you think that what you've been able to do is and, like, the majority of society is interpreting something as stress and anxiety, and you're interpreting it as, no. This isn't stress or anxiety.

I just have a decision that I need to make in my life.

Well, you you have to frame stress. It's like all all organisms experience what you could deem stress. But the power you give it, like, that's that's that's a difference maker. Mhmm. You know, like, before this before this podcast, I went out to my garage, and I got in my aerodyne mic.

And I did a sprint workout for thirty minutes. But that was physically stressful. Like, of course, it was. I'm sweating. It's over 90 degrees, 90% here.

It's hot. Yeah. My body is under duress. Like, mentally, like, okay. I'm gonna have to push myself.

But in my mental narrative conversation, am I calling it the stressful activity that sucks and shit? This is gonna be hard? No. I don't I don't ever call anything that. Is it the language that you use gives something power or, you know, or it takes power away.

If you speak into existence ordinary experiences as continuously being stressful, then they will be. That they will. You know? Word you know, words are magic that way. Or you could change the way that your you can change your internal dialogue.

You can change the stories you tell about you can change the stories you tell yourself, and you can reframe, you know, the word at large. You know? So, like, you're describing, like, you know, stress and anxiety, it it is to be expected that anything that requires focus, competence, concentration, you taking yourself to a certain limit. Yeah. That's going to be a stressful situation because it it's taxing.

How could it not be? Is being ancient anxious about that experience gonna help that ex help the experience? No. Yeah. You are psychologically conditioning yourself to experience things a distinct way every time you think of them and how you'd find them.

So So, you know, this is this operant conditioning. If I tell you, hey, man. Let's do this workout. Workout's gonna fucking suck. Gonna be painful.

And I tell they tell you that 20 times before you do it. How do you think that workout's gonna go? Yeah. Probably gonna suck and be painful. If I tell you, hey, man.

Let's do this workout. It's gonna be really challenging. You're gonna you're gonna love it. Like, you're gonna feel fucking amazing at the end. Mhmm.

And I tell you that, again, 20 times before you do the workout, you'll probably look forward to it Mhmm. Even during the if the experience thereof is, again, difficult, challenging. You know, for, you know, for men, for, you know, for most of our lives, we're gonna hit points in time where people are gonna pit on us, depend on us. We're gonna be responsible for others. We are going to be expected to fulfill certain tasks and duties.

Is calling those things hard and stressful, anxiety inducing gonna make them easier to execute? No. It it's not. It's not. So why would you describe it that way?

Yeah. I don't know why. You know, this is, yeah, this is sort of like a yeah. The the military if you if you take military training. And and I don't idolize military service the way some guys do.

A lot of guys a lot of men's a compensation for what they feel is around the lack of masculinity. But military structures are a very good example of how men operate on sort of, like, an optimized like, if you were to optimize masculinity and its qualities, you'd have a military structure, you know, military style of execution. Yeah. A militarized system. You know, these militaries are traditionally are men working with other men to accomplish a common task.

There's no women in the situation, which is great. That's why they're productive, hopefully. So what makes that productive? Well, men are objective. We have a task at hand.

We need to get done. How do we get done? We have to assign duties. We need to have people who are skilled at whatever the duty is. You need to train to be good at something.

And, you know, what is military training and, you know, for pretty much every military on Earth? You go through a certain gauntlet of physical experience that requires you to perform regardless of how you are feeling. You just have to perform, and you figure out the end of the boot camp or the selection process like, oh, shit. I can perform at a high level and be a competent individual, and my emotional state doesn't actually have much interference with my performance. In fact, depending upon how I frame my experience, my emotional state can make me more prepared, more competent, more capable of taking on challenge.

And the negative feelings I might have of stress, worry, fear, anxiety, they are mostly irrelevant. It's it's you psyching yourself out.

Mhmm. Per performance regardless of how you feel, you mentioned that that's massive because we've completely forgotten what that actually means as a society.

Yes. %. Well and now we try to modify performance based on feeling, which you end up with a shitty level of performance if you can even call it that. Mhmm. You know, this this is why I love combat sports where if if you put someone in a situation and this is not this is not compared to, like, special forces training elite, but, you know, combat sports are they're challenging for most people because you're under duress.

Someone's trying to actually kinda hurt you, and you you have to handle the situation. So, you know, if you're in a situation like, alright. We're gonna spar today, and we're gonna spar for eight rounds. So, you know, you know, eight rounds, three minutes, you know, we might break. So we're gonna be going, like, over half hour or maybe an hour.

We're gonna do 10 rounds, 12 rounds. That's in forty five minutes. So we're gonna be trying to beat her forty five minutes. The only way you're gonna get through that is, one, with a level of basic conditioning. Two, you have to be calm.

You know, this is why I recommend combat sports for men. It's basically mental physical therapy. Like, it teaches you to be calm and get your shit out of control. %. Because if you're if you're not, you're gonna gas out or you're gonna scare yourself or you're gonna hurt someone else inadvertently.

Mhmm.

You know?

Or you're gonna you're gonna have a fucking panic attack that's really that bad. And you're gonna realize shit. Like, I am fucking competent. And this is why men love combat sports so much because whether it's jujitsu or boxing or Muay Thai or kickboxing or whatever it is, it puts you under pressure, and pressure is what makes men. Pressure is what makes character.

It's what creates character. And you have to act. You have to account for, you know, these these these stressors. They're, you know, being put on you all at the same time, and you rise and you're capable for good things.

Yeah. The competency I mean, my experience in combat sports is through jiu jitsu, and I feel like the difference between a blue belt and a white belt, obviously, there's a certain level of competency, but it it it really is that ability to actually calm your mind in situations where you are on the defensive for a certain period of time. Like, if you're on your back and someone's moving into a more, advantageous position on you and you don't really have much leverage to to pull, your if your first time if it's one of your first times on the mat, you're gonna exhaust yourself trying to defend yourself

Yeah.

Rather than take the approach of someone who's been in class for a hundred times, hundred plus times, which is let me slow the situation down and actually Mhmm. Figure out a way to get out of this or figure out a way to stall so I can at least build a little bit of leverage back into play here. I I think that combat sports is totally something and just physical activity in general.

Mhmm.

It's like you build there's an objective truth to a lot of martial arts and physical activity. Like, if you get hit in the face, you got hit in the face. And you you didn't put your hands up, you didn't move your head quick enough, but, like, there's a reason why you got hit in the face. So I think I mean, that's one of the reasons why I resonate with with sports like that. It's like, there's just, there's a reality that you have to live in order to get better.

Yes. Yeah. 100%. I mean, that's why they're so powerful. Yeah, before we started recording, I was talking about how I I've gotten more into training cardio like endurance the past two years or so.

Like, I've I was never a runner. Yeah. I base I basically started I decided to become, like, a runner at 32. You know, it's pretty late. You know, but, like, what is running?

Like, why why do people hate running so much? Because running is 100% mental. Yeah. Like, yeah, they're obviously, like, yeah, there's a physical component to it. If you've got bad knees, bad hips, Achilles tendonitis, pelotonitis, like, you have to have baseline physical qualities in place to be able to, you know, pick up your feet and run.

You know, you you should probably work on your gait, you know, wear better shoes, you know, learn how to carry your body properly through space. Like, there there is physical physical component. Don't be wrong. But once you got that physical component in place, what determines your running performance? Your mentality.

Totally. Whether it's running one mile, two miles, three miles, four miles, five miles, you realize it's literally just a decision making process.

Yes.

There's a physical component, but past that initial physical component, it just it becomes a decision making process. Am I gonna run for a half hour or an hour? What's what's the limiting factor? Is it, oh, my body's gonna break down in forty five minutes and then shut up? No.

Your body is gonna keep going if you decide to. Mhmm. So you have to choose. And that fucking kills people, especially if you come from a background where you're used to you know, especially for guys that just like the lift. Like, you're used for very short duration intense activities.

Forty five seconds versus thirty minutes of making the same decision over and over and over again.

Yeah.

It's a it's a challenge. It's mentally fatiguing. Mhmm. That's why that's why most people fucking hate doing it.

Yes. And in some ways, it's almost like an epiphany for this for a certain type of person too because you realize, like you said, you start to think your to yourself, holy shit. The body actually does follow the mind. And if I consciously decide to keep taking another step, I'll finish. I'm not saying you're gonna finish.

You know, there there's obviously different performance metrics like you talked about for how quickly you do it. You're like, hey. If I wanna run marathon, as long as you don't have any pre existing physical conditions, you can choose to run a marathon. I genuinely believe that, which is fucking insane. But most people, I think, don't like to realize that they have that almost, like, inner power within them to be able to do that.

It scares a lot of people.

Yeah. I mean, like, what is running what is even running an hour? It's just like it's you you said it's decisioning process. You're you're gonna have to choose to do this. Mhmm.

Yeah. If you decide, like, okay. I'm gonna run these whatever how many miles. Like, I've realized running like, pacing doesn't really matter, you know? Unless unless you're if you're gonna be competitive in a different story, but, like, you know, for, you know, for if you're recreational or beginner just doing it for the, you know, health, mental benefits, what matters is the task of completion.

So whether it's a fast mile or a slow mile or a fast marathon or a slow marathon or a fast run or a slow run, did you finish it or not? Did it get done? Yes or no? It did. Okay.

Awesome. Good. Like, you're making progress that way. Mhmm. You know, if you psych yourself out halfway through, you're like, fuck.

This is really far. I just you know, like, why are you stopping? I don't basically, I don't feel like it. Yeah. I remember having this moment in Thailand where I was hanging around this hill.

Yeah. Like, my my feet were fucked. Cramped up. Couch cramping, like and I can and everyone like, I'm getting passed up. This is, like, you know, it's two years ago.

This is just, like it took like, I I don't know how long it took to even go up the hill. I'm, like, I hit this point in time, like, fuck. Like and I I'm not running this at this point. Like, I'm just taking steps. Like, if I keep moving my feet, I'm eventually gonna get the top.

Like, it will happen. It's not gonna happen fast, but I'll get I I'll get there. And you know what? Fucking did it. And the next time, same thing.

Like, yeah. Cramped up again. Oh, shit. Yeah. Like, feet are dead.

I'm like, well, I'm a little bit faster than before. So long as I just keep moving your fucking feet, you know, you'll get the top. And I did. You know? And like you guys said, like, you have that breakthrough moment.

Like, this is it's just a choice. Yeah. There's nothing there's nothing else but that.

I particularly I like the mental games that you can play with yourself when it comes to endurance stuff because, like, in a lot of ways, it's like your it's like, your mind is walking your body through the entire experience like walking a dog. Like, the dog doesn't know how far it's gonna go. Like, the person makes up far it's gonna go. Right? So if you can figure out the zone to get into, like, there is, like, I think, like, a zone that you can just steady state, just keep going.

But Oh, yeah.

You have

to play, like, these little mental games with yourself. It's kind of a I think, like, the last dance, the documentary about Michael Jordan, like, all the games he would play with himself to perform at the highest level in practice and in games. Like, these are kinda similar tactics to just, like, basically fake yourself out into excelling at something.

Yeah. Well, that that's something that you realize that competitive people sporting competition, you're obviously competing against other athletes. Like, you wanna beat other people, but there that mental edge, it is with yourself. It's like, okay. Even even if I'm winning and I'm beating you, can I beat you a little bit better by setting up an internal game?

You know, like, within my within my within my game, then it's gonna put me, like, one over on you that much more.

Yeah. Yes. It's so I feel like so much of it comes back to programming. And so last fall, Harrison and I, we both did our first Iron Man together. And I would say that out of every 10 people that it would come up in conversation with, eight out of 10 people would instantly respond and be like, oh, there's no way that I can do that.

Yeah. It's like the instant negative programming. Mhmm. The concept of finishing is already off the table. And it's like, I couldn't run I I remember when I graduated college playing baseball, I couldn't run fucking three miles.

And then a few years later, I'm doing an Ironman. So it's like, if I I I really believe if I could do it, anyone could do it. But most people just instantly decide, oh, yep. I'm not capable of it. And it's like, yes.

You are. If you choose that you're gonna finish the race and take quitting off the table and do the training, anyone is capable of doing something like that.

Yeah. I I call it, like, a lowly coach. This is when I play baseball's kid. Like like, this is sports have a lot of wisdom in them, but, like, this is this is super cliche. Like, any kid that ever played any sport, like, it's, like, it's all about attitude.

Right? Yep. You you at some point in time, a coach said that to you, like, you got a bad attitude. It's, you know, this is all about attitude. You you got you become an adult, and I realized that, like, in my twenties, I'm like, you know, life life basically is just all bad attitude.

It is. If you have a bad attitude, like, you're probably gonna fucking fail. You have a good attitude, you're probably gonna succeed, or at least you're more likely to not fail. I I I can't make it any simpler than that.

Did did you have any realizations while you were training, for six months Just, like, very in tune with, like were you doing two a day trainings for the Muay Thai stuff?

No. I start I start with one a day for the first six months, and I now I now I did two a day. Wow. Yeah. I I had a lot of physical stuff that I had to, like, overcome, which yeah.

It was it was super grind, but, like, it was worth it. Yeah. Like, I just I I had, like, I had patellar tendonitis, Achilles tendonitis. Like, my feet were dead. I had no bounce.

Mhmm. I don't like I remember, like, jump it's being able to jump rope, like, took months and months and months and months and months. Being able to run, same thing. Like, I I had a lot of intuition. I had some interviews in ballet.

Mhmm. Like, I had to sort of, like, remedy it, you know, finally. And, also, like, I mean, this gets a lot more specific, but all the years of lifting Yeah. It's like, you know, for that's really all I've done for a decade. Lifting weights makes you stiff.

It doesn't make you elastic if that's all that you do. And so my athleticism was just kinda gone. Like, I was I was it was not bouncy. My ability to rebound, speed light in my feet was not there. I had to just I had to rebuild all that.

But yeah. So it took about six months, but then I got them all back.

Did, did nutrition play a role in that? Were you eating kinda similarly to how people in Thailand were eating, or did you kinda, like, sit Really? Your

No. I mean, this high protein diet, that's always my my answer. Like, I just ate a high protein diet. Yeah. What made me realize, like, with training is that specificity is real.

You will be good at exactly what you trained for. No more, no less. Mhmm. If that's lifting weights in a gym and leveraging load, that's what we'll be good at. If that's being able to do the light on your feet for fucking 10 rounds in a ring, that's what you'll be good at.

Those two things really don't carry over that much.

Right.

Because, you know, so my training my even now has changed dramatically. I do way more cardio now than I did, you know, three or four years ago. I do very little lifting. You know, and my focus is constantly to some really, it's like what I just call elasticity. This big, big light on my feet, big bouncy, you know, move around easily.

I mean, I don't really care if my numbers are any lifts anymore. It just doesn't matter at all. Right. Hey. And then also, you know, improving fight IQ, you know, kicking.

You know, there's a punch and kicking mechanics. Like, you know, there's certain there's certain basic elements you have to have in place. But, yeah, like, that that all started, like, in Thailand then. Yeah. But those but those first six months, I I mean, I remember the first workout of it's, like, forty five minutes.

I was just fucking dying. You know? This yeah. I mean, they're like, we're we're outside. Like, you know, the we the the gym had a covering.

There's no there's no air conditioning. I'm in the ring for the first time. Yeah. I think he's you know, like, the coach, he's holding pads. Yeah.

Like, it just you you like, for anyone for no one for anyone's ever for everyone that had for everyone that has never trained combat sports, has ever trained boxing, or has ever trained kicks, it is fucking exhausting boxing. Like, it's a certain level of conditioning that's quite real. Yeah. Like, if you actually box a round, like, nonstop moving, you're throwing punches, and you've never done before, like, my heart rate was probably, like, one ninety. I remember it was being lightheaded.

That's holy fuck. I'm looking at the clock. I'm like, it's been I remember the state. I looked at the clock. It was like, I got there at twelve.

It's at 12:07. And it it's been two rounds. I'm like, holy shit. Yeah. Like, but you gotta keep moving.

And then you, like, you realize that, like, one of those lessons in epiphany. Right? It's like, okay. I've so long as I keep breathing and don't pass out, I'm not gonna pass out. Yes.

And then, like, that that that that was my starting point. You know, like, strike from zero. And you just you you build up from there. And then, you know, at the of course, you get the end of it, then it's like, you know, after so many months after year, it's like, alright. Let's let's go two hours today.

Like, cool, man. Like, yeah. Two hours. Fuck it. I love it.

It feels good. You know? Or you'll have those breakthrough moments where, like, you're just like, you're not getting tired. You're you're getting fatigued. Like, you can't get truly tired like you once were.

Mhmm. It would take just a stupid amount of training where you can go two hours and you can still you can keep going. Yeah. Yeah. And, like, at that point, like, man, man, it feels good.

It's powerful. Mhmm. Like like, you know, you get that that mental state, like, you know, fuck with me. Yeah. Like, I'm a fucking man.

And then, you know, it gives you a quiet kind of confidence. Like, okay. There's a certain capability I have that most other human beings do not. Yeah. That's a good feeling.

Do you think that there was also a level of confidence that came from just flat out being willing to put on a beginner set and just try something new in a field that you've never done before?

Yeah. I I would say so. Like, it makes you realize, like, why are for for combat sports in particular, like, why are most people not good at them? It's because they quit because it's hard. It's it's it is.

It's it's a you know, if you're gonna take it personally, it's a very discouraging process. You realize that you're weak, then this goes this could be boxing, dude. It's again, it doesn't really matter what it is. You realize, one, you're fucking weak. You have no conditioning.

You have no endurance. You're really easy to hit. Anyone can fucking tap you out. You're fucking cramping up. You're a total fucking spaz.

You look like shit. You move like shit. Your videos look like shit. You are shit, and you're gonna be shit for a while. So show up again tomorrow

Yeah.

For the next year, and maybe if you do this for five year you know, again, this has nothing to do with talent. You're right. It's like, in combat sports, if if you do any combat sport for five years, you're probably, like, kinda world class at it. Because everybody else fucking quit in, like, month two because it was fucking hard and discouraging because you get beat up a lot. So you don't have to be talented.

You just keep doing it. And after, you know, a certain amount of time, you're like, you know, I'm kinda good at this. Not the best, but I'm kinda, like, I'm I'm competent at it. Why? He just kept doing it past six months, a year, two years.

That that that's the only that's that's secret right there. You know? Like, I mean, I've seen lots of guys I've met lots of guys who were, like, they were they're not necessarily athletically gifted, but they've been doing it for, whatever, seven years. You know? Like, they started around '20.

They're in late twenties. Like, pretty fucking good. Mhmm. Why? They just kept showing up.

Mhmm. They didn't they didn't care how badly they performed in any given day. They kept showing up. And once you get to those breakthrough moments where you get a little bit better, a little bit better, a little bit better, you have some confidence, then it becomes very rewarding, and you wanna keep improving. Because why would you quit that point?

Mhmm. If you've done something for two years and you're reasonably good at it, oh, you're okay good at it, why are you gonna stop completely? Mhmm. What for? What what was all the time worth?

Right.

Yeah. Like, why would I stop doing cardio now? Like, oh, you know, like, like, I had a newborn son. Right? I'm like, so I haven't been able to train the past two weeks or three weeks.

Yeah. Three weeks. I'm like, well, man, it's just like, am I gonna quit now? I'm like, no. But, like, what the fuck did I do with this shit for the last two years?

Now, like, yeah, it's plus, it becomes addictive too. You know? Because when you actually do come at sports, like, you you fucking love it. Like, being able to actually fight with other people even in a controlled setting, it's fucking fun. Something else like it.

Everything else is fucking boring now. You know, boring fucking lifting laces? Stupidly fucking boring. I go to the gym now. Like, I I'm that guy at the gym where I can go there.

I I rest five minutes between sets. I will 100% look at my phone. This is this is just not thrilling anymore. It's something there's nothing about this that's fucking cruel. It's like, I'm gonna do the same exercises I did fifteen years ago.

You know, progressive overload. Like, I know the process. I'm like, this is fine. It's, you know, it's it's good. It's good for me.

Is it exciting? No. Yeah. Is anyone trying to fucking punch me in the face? No.

Is anyone trying to fucking take out my legs? No. Am I having to check kicks? No. I'm just I'm sitting on this fucking machine in, like, air conditioning air conditioning environment.

This is fucking easy. Yeah.

You, you wrote a really interesting article about imposter syndrome, I think, back in 2019. Did you deal with any of that when you're getting into the Muay Thai stuff, or is it just like, you're basically like shit, so you can't really feel like an imposter, I guess. No.

I've I've I've said this before when I people ask about, like, personal training. Yeah. I've been a post trainer, but personal training is the only job I've ever done, technically. Did I feel like an imposter when I was personal training? No.

Because I I knew even on day one that I I knew that I knew more than my clients because I've gone through certification. I had some scant knowledge. So I knew more than that. And, also, I was just very objective that everybody starts from zero. What is there to be an imposter about?

If you are doing the thing, if you're doing the skill and you're taking it seriously and you want to improve and you're you're showing up and you're present during that experience, what are you faking exactly? I don't know. Like, you know, you ask people, and it's because I get asked a question a lot by, like, a lot of young guys, even young young young women sometimes follow me. I feel like imposter. Like, are you bullshitting everybody there?

Like, you don't wanna be there? No. Like, you wanna be there? Okay. Are you serious about getting better?

Yeah. Why do you why do you think you're faking it then? Well, I don't think I'm faking it, but I think other people might think I'm faking it. So then what? So your issue is that you think other people are thinking that you're thinking that you're full of it.

So now, you know, that's more so just like, like, like, white narcissism. Mhmm. So now you're you're so you're making assumption that they're thinking about you, and you're thinking about them thinking about you. Like and that's your problem. That that has nothing to do with your actual skill set or lack thereof.

Right. So that's, that's just why I call it you're siphoning yourself out. Yeah. If you're there and you're serious and other people can see that, you're fine. Keep showing up.

%.

Maybe it's more so just a lack of confidence than anything else.

I mean, this is the interesting thing about confidence and self esteem. Self esteem is very much, like, nineteen nineties kind of racially unpopular. But this idea that we have to feel good at all times while doing, I I don't know, anything, a new experience, taking on new task, new channels, new skill, we're gonna learn something. It's supposed to feel good. It's supposed to make you feel good about yourself.

No. It's fucking not. Yeah. If if most of the time, if you are serious about improving at a certain domain of endeavor, it's gonna make you feel bad because you're bad at it, and it will take time to get good. You know?

So expecting it to, you know, pump up your self esteem, whatever the fuck that means, and, you know, your I I don't know. Like, your your your passion, I guess. Like, oh, I'm gonna feel, like, passionate about it. Most people are not passionate about anything, like, for a start. But if you have a talent for it or you get good at for long enough, it becomes rewarding.

Now you're passionate. Okay. Cool. Yeah. In the beginning, you know, as a novice, that just comes down to whether you're serious or not.

I mean, you you can see that in you could see that in fucking little league sports. You have a group of kids playing fucking pony league baseball. There's those kids that are serious, and they show up and they're very determined. Whether they're good or not doesn't really matter. It's like, okay.

This kid's serious. And then you have the kids that don't wanna be there. They're not serious. Yeah. And that applies to every experience that probably happens in adult in any professional environment.

You have the people that are working the job that really want the job, but they need the money. Then you have the people that do, in fact, care about the job. Yeah. Which one are you?

Yep. And there's a massive difference in performance between those two people. Massive.

Like, there's, like, like, Pareto distribution Pareto distribution and power distribution rule most things. Like, I I I I was amazed by that when I was, like, a personal trainer, like, at a gym the first time. Yeah. I was, like, 20. I I think I I already read, like, the what was it called?

The Pareto principle. That's what Mhmm. And then, you know, it's like one of those, like, oh, wow. You you see it everywhere. Right?

And I I was at this work in the gym, and the the performance of the training staff followed that to a t. About 80% of the department income was made by 20% of trainers, and the rest was just a fucking long tail curve of, you know, the next people in line that made a little less less less, and then down to the trainers that weren't really selling anything. You see that in gym membership. 80% of, gym members never show up. Only 20% do.

Yep. Yeah. And of those 20%, it's, like, 10% of them are there every day. It's this really small percentage. You see that in a compression environments.

Like, you know, most of your income, most of your projects, most of your advancement is gonna come from, like, your top 20% of people. And then you got fucking everybody else. You know? And if you are in that position of being a manager or if you're paying the you know, your employees, you're you're responsible for handling your performance, you always have to reward the highest performers. If the highest performers go, if they quit, if they leave, they say fuck this, you're fucked.

Yeah.

It's all gonna fall apart. Yeah. I saw it happen more than once in the different gyms where the top level trainers doing thirty, forty appointments a week, getting all the clients there in the gym all the time. Like, they're, like, kinda face the gym. They quit.

They leave. The whole department within two months collapses. Mhmm. Everyone, you know, else everyone else, yeah, you know, well, so and so left jam. I guess, you know, the grass is greener, you know, being independent or, you know, working for a competitor.

Fuck this. I quit.

Yeah. Yeah. Be being in a corporate environment for six plus years, you totally see it how these, like, organizations and, individual motivations kinda take form. It's it's really an interesting social science. We're about an hour in, and we haven't even talked about some of your nutrition principles, which I think I would love to dive in into and, just hear more about because you write about it extensively.

One of the things you write about specifically is testosterone, which I think kinda plays into a lot of things we've already talked about. But it's it's this, like, new age epidemic of a lot of young males having these declines in testosterone and not really knowing what to do about it. But you you write about it very consistently, and I'm curious if you have some sort of protocol mindset shift that people need to get into when it comes to kind of changing, the the negative setbacks that they've experienced when it comes to testosterone.

Yeah. The testosterone levels I mean, that so that is factual. Like, they have declined globally, the last, like, four decades or so. You know, the reasons why are not clear. Like, it's it's very hard to pinpoint.

Like, this the the major prime suspects for environmental estrogens environmental estrogens Environmental estrogens, environmental toxins. So, like, you know, plastics, you know, glycol phosphates, you know, preservatives maybe in food, you know, you know, petrochemicals, you know, new car smell, cleaning products. Like, you know, what is it, though? It's not any one thing. You know?

And for so a lot of guys, they have low testosterone. They have low testosterone levels or, like, it's it's so far harder today. They're young. You can improve it through lifestyle enhancement. So that's basically it's sunlight.

Let's just say, like, a whole foods, high protein diet, exercise, resistance resistance training, possibly supplement supplementation, zinc, boron, increasing vitamin d levels, improving overall, like, micronutrition. So, like, things can be done beyond but then beyond that, if you do all that and it's still not going up, then, like, that's where you have to start looking at, like, an exog exogenous supplementation. But I think most young men today, they should be able to get their t levels up, you know, through natural means. Yeah. And, you know, probably the things that play the biggest role that I've seen, like, definitely diet 100%.

Yeah. Increasing protein intake, saturated fat intake, healthy carbohydrate intake, increasing the amount of zinc rich zinc rich foods in the diet, oysters, you know, or, you know, powdered oysters even. That that does make a difference. You know, sleep is a big factor as well. If you get subpar sleep, if you're one of those guys where you're staying up all night, weekends are late, yeah, that could reduce your testosterone level levels down by, you know, ten, fifteen, 20, 20 five percent.

It could be quite substantial. Mhmm. Yeah. It could be more if you're only sleeping five hours or less, it could be cut even half literally. Wow.

That's all yeah. So all that plays a role. You know, but the the modern environment is also just obesogenic in general. If you're very mindless about how you live, you're gonna end up basically just fat and overweight. That's that's how it's gonna go.

You're gonna you're gonna end up being probably 28 with the insulin resistance, 5% body fat, skinny fat. You're gonna look like shit and feel like shit. And why how'd that happen? Well, look what you ate with how you lived.

Mhmm. Is there an ideal test range that you think men should be shooting for, like, someone in their twenties and thirties?

I would say if you are under the age of 30, it should be you know, it's a general rule of thumb. It should be your total sales should be 700 and above. It could be $6.50. It could be $5.90. If it if it's below 500 total and you are younger than 30, you need to look at your lifestyle hard Mhmm.

And make some necessary changes. It it shouldn't be that low. You know, that that would have been hypogonadal thirty years ago.

Can, can certain things like, I mean, alcohol is one that probably reduces, testosterone pretty substantially, caffeine intake or, like, something that might drain your, adrenals? Would that be another thing that you would look at?

So adrenal burnout is not a medically recognized condition, but what high caffeine intake does tend to do is it does increase cortisol levels Like, it does. You know? That that's part of why caffeine works. It'd be like it increases your stress hormone a little bit, and it makes you makes you more alert. You know?

I mean, cortisol is not a bad hormone. It's just it can be bad when it's in excess. So if you're if you're hyper caffeinated, where you're one of those guys where it's like, yeah, you wake up, it's like, oh, the pot of coffee. And it's it's 5PM. You're still drinking coffee ten hours later, which this is super common in general corporate tech world.

You know, just the constant caffeine all day. Mhmm. It's like yeah. If you are if you so if you're consuming a thousand milligrams of caffeine a day on top of staring at your laptop, on top of being on your phone, on top of sleeping shitty, your course level's probably gonna be elevated. And it would not surprise me if your testosterone levels are low because there's no way in God's earth that's not affecting your fucking sleep.

Mhmm. You Yeah. I've seen this with family members even where I've I was chewing chewing a an uncle of mine out recently where it was, like, it was, like, 10:00 at night. He was, like, drinking coffee. He's like, like, like, what the fuck are you drinking coffee at ten for?

Well, yeah, I I got fucking work to do on, you know, on the laptop. I'm like, it's fucking 10PM, and you're drinking coffee right now. Like a fucking Java mug. Yeah. You gotta do what you gotta do.

I'm like, how how many of those have you had today? Seven, eight, nine? He doesn't even know. I'm like, yeah. I mean, he's also caught in the cycle.

Like, a lot of people are working, you know, regular jobs where it's like, I'm I'm tired, so I'm drinking coffee, which kinda makes me more I I'm tired. I drink coffee. It makes me stay up longer, which makes me more tired, which makes me needs more coffee, and that process repeats itself every fucking day. Mhmm. And then you add in, like, a shitty diet on top of that.

It's like, alright. I I think I know why your disruption levels are kind of in the shit. You know, it's not because there's anything wrong with you physically, but your lifestyle inputs are fucking you up.

%.

I love it. I love it. Well, look, man. This has been an awesome conversation for the for the people that are interested in connecting with you a little bit more, Ajak. What's the best way for them to go about doing thing?

Is that Twitter? I know you have a newsletter too.

Yeah. So Twitter handle, obviously, like a I tweet every day. So a j underscore cortez. All my long form content is on the newsletter. So a lot of the subjects that I talked about in the past, you know, hour and a half and what was hopefully decent level detail.

Substantiation, like, I've talked about them on the newsletter at some point or another. I mean, obviously, I've you know, Instagram, same panel as Twitter. Instagram is very personal to fitness content. Yeah. So, like, it's, like, you know, all the training tutorials, that's all there.

But there's only three places to find me. And I'm pretty accessible, obviously, in the DMs, on the other platforms.

Totally. And there there are also some awesome talks that you've given on just, like, masculinity strength, some of the archetypes that you talked about on YouTube that we both listen to and have gotten a lot of value out of. But, awesome. So we'll we'll link to those in the show notes, man, but just really appreciate you coming on. It's awesome to meet you.

Thanks for having me, man. It's a great conversation.

Like we said in August, if we're not in wheelchairs, we should link up and hit a stake or something like that in Houston. I know you're a busy man, but it'll be great to meet you in person.

Yeah. No. Let me know. Definitely. Awesome.

That'd be super cool.

Love it. Alright, brother. Well, we appreciate it, man. We'll talk to you soon.

Good talk, guys. Adios. Thanks, man.